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Sunday, February 14, 2010
The Deadliest Sin
I’m not a Catholic, but I am looking forward to the fish fries that are going to be available between now and the end of Lent. (I’m a freak for Captain D’s; I won’t deny it.) And as it is getting to be that time of year where we think about the areas of our lives we wish to improve upon, because no one is perfect, I have to confess: I am a terrible student.
I’m taking a class. Simple. 3 weeks; just email; you’re not getting a grade. It’s a course on secrets. Secrets we keep; why we keep secrets; repercussions of those secrets being revealed—the whole shebang. Yes, the class I had everyone vote on a couple weeks ago. I’m in it; and I’m enjoying it.
And now I’ve remembered I’m a terrible student.
Here are the reasons why:
Anyway, confession aside, our current assignment in the secrets class is identifying the reason why you’re keeping the secret. SHAME, PRIDE, FEAR OF PUNISHMENT or GUILT. And the class—aside from the reasons above—has been good for me. I think I’ve figured out some things about Adam and Eve, of their time before the divorce, that I didn’t know (or realized I knew) before. I realized that most of the secrets I ever have my characters keep are attributed to PRIDE. The pig-headed variety. And I don’t even care. I just laugh as I think about it because I can’t blame them. I would do the same thing if I were in their situation, which clearly isn’t news since I’m writing them and all.
Jenny Crusie wrote a blog a few weeks ago called the Tao of Bob, and one of the revelations that Bob made was that your therapist knows what’s wrong with you the first session you meet. But you end up going for two years because they can’t tell you what’s wrong with you—mainly because you’re going to be too pig-blind stubborn to believe them. You have to figure it out yourself. I know this to be true. My therapist operated this exact way; and I had my suspicions from the beginning she knew my dirty secrets, the dirty secrets I refused to share with myself or her. Even though she already knew them.
But there it is. The core hero and heroine I write in every story I scribble. They might have low self-esteem and neuroses out the wazoo, but by Golly, they have their Pride. And if we’re writing ourselves—not that any of us are blood-sucking warriors or demon-slayers—then clearly my writing therapy is all about not succumbing to the deadliest sin of all. Good thing it’s fiction because I am not nearly as optimistic that I can implement it in my own life nearly as well as my characters can.
Oh, well. At least there’s fish.
So line up for confession: what have you realized your writing reveals most about you? And have you ever taken a writing class that you really enjoyed? Does the thought that your deepest secrets will be revealed through your writing and realized by everyone who reads your work make you break out in a cold sweat? And how do you eat your fish: battered or breaded?
I’m taking a class. Simple. 3 weeks; just email; you’re not getting a grade. It’s a course on secrets. Secrets we keep; why we keep secrets; repercussions of those secrets being revealed—the whole shebang. Yes, the class I had everyone vote on a couple weeks ago. I’m in it; and I’m enjoying it.
And now I’ve remembered I’m a terrible student.
Here are the reasons why:
1) The homework actually makes me think hard about my characters, digging deep beneath some layers and revealing vulnerabilities. This is a problem because I like to think of myself as the sort of general who wouldn’t send his troops out to run over a hill he wasn’t willing to run over himself. And I’m not remotely willing to run over that fucking hill. My layers and vulnerabilities are going to continue to be buried and ignored and left alone—and I swear to God, if you try to hug me, I’ll rip off your arm and club you with it. So I’m trying to do homework and make my characters do things and discuss things I wouldn’t be do or discuss if you paid me. I feel like a hypocritical therapist. And it’s no good pointing out the characters don’t actually exist, because they do.
2) Not only do I not like digging deep for vulnerabilities, I don’t like sharing them with the rest of the class. I couldn’t avoid it forever; the teacher was nagging. I settled down in my chair and figured out some secret stuff for Adam and the rest; I was most comfortable discussing Lucifer’s vulnerabilities. Finally satisfied with my results, at least to a degree, I realized I needed to post this to the rest of a class. A class of my peers, who I had only met by sending out a one-paragraph “hi-howdy-how-are-you” meet and greet. I don’t know these people. I don’t know their judgments or knee-jerk pet peeves. I might be sitting in a room of fundamentalists for all I knew and I was going to send out my characters’ vulnerabilities to these potential jackals? Not only am I a hypocritical therapist, I’m a horrible therapist, ratting out her clients to a bunch of strangers.
3) My latent Hermione Granger gene. You know the gene I’m talking about. The one every hyper-excelling perfectionist has beating beneath her breastbone. I don’t want to be good in this class; I want to be the one who earned 103%. And I should be ashamed of myself. Scottish kings have been stabbed for less. And if Ron were here, he probably would.
Anyway, confession aside, our current assignment in the secrets class is identifying the reason why you’re keeping the secret. SHAME, PRIDE, FEAR OF PUNISHMENT or GUILT. And the class—aside from the reasons above—has been good for me. I think I’ve figured out some things about Adam and Eve, of their time before the divorce, that I didn’t know (or realized I knew) before. I realized that most of the secrets I ever have my characters keep are attributed to PRIDE. The pig-headed variety. And I don’t even care. I just laugh as I think about it because I can’t blame them. I would do the same thing if I were in their situation, which clearly isn’t news since I’m writing them and all.
Jenny Crusie wrote a blog a few weeks ago called the Tao of Bob, and one of the revelations that Bob made was that your therapist knows what’s wrong with you the first session you meet. But you end up going for two years because they can’t tell you what’s wrong with you—mainly because you’re going to be too pig-blind stubborn to believe them. You have to figure it out yourself. I know this to be true. My therapist operated this exact way; and I had my suspicions from the beginning she knew my dirty secrets, the dirty secrets I refused to share with myself or her. Even though she already knew them.
But there it is. The core hero and heroine I write in every story I scribble. They might have low self-esteem and neuroses out the wazoo, but by Golly, they have their Pride. And if we’re writing ourselves—not that any of us are blood-sucking warriors or demon-slayers—then clearly my writing therapy is all about not succumbing to the deadliest sin of all. Good thing it’s fiction because I am not nearly as optimistic that I can implement it in my own life nearly as well as my characters can.
Oh, well. At least there’s fish.
So line up for confession: what have you realized your writing reveals most about you? And have you ever taken a writing class that you really enjoyed? Does the thought that your deepest secrets will be revealed through your writing and realized by everyone who reads your work make you break out in a cold sweat? And how do you eat your fish: battered or breaded?
Labels:
7 deadly sins,
Captain's Quarters (Hellion),
classes,
fish,
Lent,
PRIDE,
writing,
Writing for Rum
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69 comments:
Is there a need for 'Writers Anonymous', or does it already exist?
A place where you can be totally unknown and share your innermost writing fears and secrets with like minded souls.
I can only imagine what its like in a writer's therapy session.
The hypno- variety seems most appropriate to me:
The therapist sets his pendulum swinging.
" Gaze into my eyes my dear one.
Let your heart beat to the swing of the pendulum.
Open your mind to the flow from the aether.
Let those caged secrets free.
Let them fly like birds to the sky.
You too can then be free as a bird"
All sounds a bit fishy to me! *grin*
I'm enjoying this class too. Well, not to so much the nagging, but the deep thinking required. I've flushed out a lot about Josephine I didn't know before, which is excellent. Her secrets are definitely predicated on shame. Deep, deep shame. And I'm realizing I write that a lot.
I really don't want to know what that says about me. I don't *think* I feel shame over anything....
Anyway, moving on...fast...
I eat my fish battered. Mmmm battered. I always picked Long John Silvers over Cap'n D's *g*
I do miss the fish fries of my childhood. We didn't even need to wait until Lent, we had a fish fry after every HS football game. And I like breaded, but I won't turn away battered either.
I'm taking two ecourses and one is a total let down. Though I have no trouble ignoring nagging instructors. I'm a class lurker, just the way it is. I paid for it and if I want to lurk, that's my prerogative.
Without a whole lot of effort, I'm sure my characters' secrets come from guilt. Since they come from me and I come from guilt, that's probably a safe bet to make. :)
Q, I would never volunteer to be hypnotized because I know I would be one of those people who would start clucking like a chicken. *LOL*
I think that's the point. Even at a WA, I wouldn't feel safe enough to tell my secrets. I went to a therapist for 2 years and didn't feel safe enough to tell all my secrets. (Never mind she knew them without me telling her.) And I'm not like hiding bodies or anything. These aren't secrets that half the population doesn't share with me, but to me, they're MY secrets and if they're known, it would be awful. The apocalypse would happen.
Hal, see I love some of the stuff I've flushed out about Adam, but when I tried to flush out stuff on Eve--it was totally the opposite of what I wanted for Eve. It feels totally wrong.
But the Saturday writing meeting with Sin (and Grand Pixy), Sin was able to put Eve back together for me and I just need to discard whatever secrets I thought Eve had and go with this plan. *LOL*
Sin also severely questioned taking any class that made you think that much. *LOL* She's probably right. Some of the best writing I've ever done involved me not thinking.
P.S. I too am a LJS fan. That's all I knew growing up; and I have memories of Dad taking me to LJS--like when he'd take me back to college, he'd stop by there first because he knew I hated going to that particular college. Love the fish. However, there is a Captain D's on the drive home from work now, right next to the bookstore. Plus I get a lot of coupons for it. So for the moment, I go there.
Honestly if the fish is battered, I don't care what the place is called. Battered is the best!
Bo'sun, the Woody Allen of Fish Eaters, who knows too well *I* will turn down breaded fish if it's presented. Poor Bo'sun.
I'm sorry one of the classes is turning out to be completely bogus. (I hope it's not the craft one!)
I have do doubts with you that your characters' secrets come from guilt. *LOL*
Yep, it's the craft one. Not happy I wasted this money, but oh well. Maybe something better will come out of the last two weeks.
And you can't beat a good, crispy breading. You don't know what you're missing. Have you tried the new fish sandwich at Wendy's? It's battered and I've been eating them quite a bit. It's my way of rationalizing that I'm eating *healthier* fast food.
Nah, I'm not big about fish sandwiches because of the whole bread thing.
That's too bad about the craft one. It sounded really good. Is it the topic or the teaching of it?
Ahh, LJS. I thought I'd left both behind when I moved to the coast, but I can find scattered LJS. Nothing beats their fish *g* And none of this healthy crap -- I want it battered and plunked down into a fryer!
It's the teaching. Is it just me or does anyone else find it annoying when someone teaches a craft class to Romance writers and fails to use any Romance books as examples? WTF are they thinking?
You realize the bread comes off, right?
But I paid for the bread. I'd rather pay for a meal where I get more fish and no bread. Just my preference.
Actually the only thing that annoys me more than not using examples from romance novels is using your OWN romance novels to teach the class. Generally because the person teaching the class isn't someone I read. If I was taking a Jenny Crusie class, I'd LOVE using her books, but she'd be the sort of teacher who'd use various authors for samplings and not just her own. So most of the time, I'm looking at examples, thinking, "This is so boring. How did this get published?" Totally out of context and unfair, mind you, but there you go.
Does she give any examples at all? Even my instructor is giving examples of how to do the exercises so they make sense.
Hal, I'm so glad you can still find some LJS's hanging about. It'd be horrible to be out east and not have a battered fish go-to place.
Yeah for fried food!
My boss reminded me that yesterday was Chinese New Year. And I didn't get take out. Guess I'll be getting it tonight, by golly.
These days I eat fish grilled or baked 98% of the time, but the other 2%, I definitely choose battered and deep fried with lots of tartar sauce and hushpuppies. The tastes developed in childhood are hard to eradicate.
I'm with you on secrets, Hellie. I have a feeling that anyone who's stripped of all his/her secrets ends up a boring person. Of course, there is a difference in my mind between a secretive person and a person who prefers having an unread chapter or two. One of the characters in Eudora Welty's long novel Losing Battles says that people are not meant to be read like books. I agree.
Do I worry that my writing reveals my deep dark sscrets-nope. If I think about it then I can't write at all.
Most of the classes I've taken have been good. The one that made my angry though was when I did the assignment and the instructor didn't like how I did it. She then took my characters and re-wrote the scene completely changing who the characters were. Ugh! I won't take another class from her.
I don't like fish, not battered, not fried, not breaded, not...Well you get the point:)
Di
I'm still considering whether my conclusions apply to fictional characters.
Di, Sin was telling me I was thinking too much just for this very reason! So she told me to stop. I'm not sure it will work since I rarely listen to her, but I know she's right.
WHAT? That's BIZARRE. *LOL* Yeah, forgo taking another class with that one again. (Although this teacher does keep asking me "ideas" in which my story has no intention of going. Won't be going. And is darker, unfunnier, and all around not me or my story. So I can see how this could be done. Different people in the room...but still, to rewrite it. WTF.)
I understand about the fish. You'll have to do your meatless Fridays a different way. Maybe tofu or mac and cheese or something.
Janga, I love to grill my tilapia with some cajun blackening seasoning and eat it with red beans and rice. But lately I've been bad about Captain D's... It calls me.
I think I'd like a number of chapters unread. *LOL* Everything basically from age 5 to age 20. And maybe a chapter or two in my 20s.
I think your conclusions apply to fictional characters. You can't tell a character's every secret. Some backstory is just for the character and author alone.
What have you realized your writing reveals most about you?
I realize that my writing reveals that I can’t spell, use proper punctuation, know anything about grammar, and I can’t write! Also I must have been a Morse code telegraph operator in a previous life cuz I’m always posting … which is the code for S.
And have you ever taken a writing class that you really enjoyed?
See answer above. Obviously I’ve never had any writing classes.
Does the thought that your deepest secrets will be revealed through your writing and realized by everyone who reads your work make you break out in a cold sweat?
No. I have no secrets. Jesus will provide the amo. But the people whose secrets I know are probably sh**ing bricks about now… to which I say “Let them eat steak!”
And how do you eat your fish: battered or breaded?
Either way, as long as the fish doesn’t taste too fishy! ;)
I don't think you need to reveal every secret about your characters, you just have to reveal that one that is most important. The one that will make the reader love him/her forever because they relate and understand their vulnerabilities.
Now, if I only knew what that one secret might be.
She's used examples from both her own work and others, but nothing in the romance field. And she seems determined to teach us everything there is to know about everything BUT the class topic. *sigh* I'm sure it's just me as a couple of others have raved about how much her comments are helping them.
My problem is that I don't struggle to recognize deep POV, I struggle to write it. Though I usually learn by example, it's not working this time. I'm guessing my brain just isn't cut out of this technique.
I liked Julie's format...
What have you realized your writing reveals most about you?
I have a lot more sexual hangups than I ever realized... I am an observer/analyzer more than a doer. I have unacknowledged voyeristic tendencies? ;-) But I have fun!
And have you ever taken a writing class that you really enjoyed?
I adored Julie Rowe's online class about query/submission/etc. It was fun, I learned a lot and I thought she was a great guest when I hauled her onto the Revenge last year.
Does the thought that your deepest secrets will be revealed through your writing and realized by everyone who reads your work make you break out in a cold sweat?
Eh...nah. I would be embarrassed and such, but not run away-run away!
And how do you eat your fish: battered or breaded?
Husband does a divine blackened catfish that tops my list. But if doing the LJS? Breaded.
The only way I've found to improve writing a deep POV (only way for me, that is, not for everyone, obviously!) is to have someone else read the pages, and mark every spot where they wanted something deeper. No one but the author can know what that something deeper is, as they're the ones who know the characters, but for me, know *where* to go deeper is half the battle.
Hugs! Hellion - Hugs!
Julie, there is that famous saying about the madman who ran around screaming, "I'm not a madman!" That's what I always think when you say you're not a writer. There are all kinds of writers. Not just the delusional "I want to publish" kind.
I love steak! *LOL*
You know my secrets, Jules. I'm not sweating shit bricks though. So you must mean one of your famous relatives or something! :)
I agree, Bo'sun. Gotta figure out which secret is the important one, the one that will make readers identify with my heroine and not go, "Yeesh. What a selfish cow."
What books are she referencing from? That just seems odd. I can list a number of romance authors who do splendid deep POV. And I can list some that don't. *LOL* I can even set them side by side and go, "Yep, both published; and both NYT bestsellers, folks, but THIS ONE is the deeper POV. Which one do you like better?"
There are craft things my brain doesn't wrap around. Setting and description is most evident. ACTION plotting is another one. Always horrible about how I can make it worse, really worse, for my characters. And thinking up mottos or themes of my characters always makes me go back to the closet. Probably because most of my characters are cynical and have the same motto of "don't fucking hug me"...which isn't a motto and you can see why I can't wrap my head about it.
2nd: just asking for a one-armed beating with your own arm. That's fine.
Query and submission classes would be very beneficial!! I'm glad that was a very good class.
And I love blackened catfish!
Probably because most of my characters are cynical and have the same motto of “don’t fucking hug me”
LMAO!! I could get on board with this motto. I won't even hug my own mother. Personal bubble, people, PERSONAL BUBBLE!
The only way I’ve found to improve writing a deep POV (only way for me, that is, not for everyone, obviously!) is to have someone else read the pages, and mark every spot where they wanted something deeper. No one but the author can know what that something deeper is, as they’re the ones who know the characters, but for me, know *where* to go deeper is half the battle.
This is a great idea! And a great point--only the author can know what the deeper is, but someone pointing out where would be helpful.
And my mind has been hijacked by the 15 year old boy who keeps giggling and saying, "Yeah, I'll show you WHERE to go deeper." Just what I need this morning. Maybe my boss will come in and mention vibrators again.
Personal bubble, people, PERSONAL BUBBLE!
My student worker will stand right behind my chair as I'm typing sometimes. I have to turn and give her the LOOK until she realizes what she's doing. She has no concept of personal bubbles. I don't know if it's because she has a bunch of siblings...and I think people with lots of siblings don't have PB issues, or if it's because she's from Minnesota. But I've met other Minnesotans and they don't strike me as hoverers or huggers.
SIN, Hellion, 2n Chance … I’m fascinated by how many writers don’t like to be Hugged. Maybe that is what attracted you to writing in the first place? Since writing is “mentally intimate” but physically distant.
For examples, she's used lots of Ellis Peters and some Koontz. And I should say it's not been a total wash. She's been great about preaching "NO RULES!" and doesn't insist this is right for every story or even every writer. Also, there are moments in the book where deep POV works better than at other moments.
Hal - That's a great suggestion. But my problem is less the where and more the "getting inside the character's head" part. But this is also why I think I'll have better luck working it in during the revision stage. When I'm just trying to get the story on the page, I can't tie myself up with this deep stuff.
I've finally hit 100 pages and Dee pestered until I agreed to send them to her. I had to force myself to hit the send button. *sigh* It's so rough!
Chance, you are so fearless. And now I'm hungry for steak. Thanks, Jules.
I'm not a hugger, but I won't beat people for trying to hug me. Just didn't grow up in an overly affectionate family, so it's not a natural thing. Since Kiddo got her father's affectionate thing, there's a lot of hugging in our house. Which is getting odd because she's nearly as tall as I am. At TEN. Gah!
It's going to be so embarrassing when she has to bend down to hug me.
Personally, I don’t mind being hugged. Just don’t get all touchy-feely-grabby on me Without my permission LOL. And don’t ever sneak up behind me or start poking at me while you ask “WhatCha gonna do about it?” I don’t like that. The last person that did that ended up getting thrown over my shoulder. I was nice about it though… I broke her fall, then patted her cheek as I cooed in her ear ‘The next part of this move is to snap your neck…”
But this is also why I think I’ll have better luck working it in during the revision stage.
Marn and I have been talking a lot about this recently, because we're both in the early stages right now. We're both having the same problem. It's LIGHT YEARS easier to get that deeper POV at the end, than it is at the beginning. And it's always easier during revisions than first the first draft.
Usually, when I do it for other people, I ask questions, like "does the phrasing here of his dialog raise her defenses? Does it remind her or something from her past? Does it make her automatically want to snap back or does she just roll her eyes? Can you extend the metaphor about xxx from above to here and show that quick flash of anger?"
For me, the best way to practice is in spots where the character is feeling/thinking one thing, and showing something else to the other character. Like when a woman smiles and says everything is fine but is seething on the inside. Because there's such a huge discrepancy, it's easier to play up the inside and contrast it to the outside. When a character says exactly how they think/feel, it's hard to deeper because....well...they just put it all out there *g*
Where to go deeper. LOL! You have a dirty mind, Hellie. I'm going to come jump in the gutter with you -- you're having more fun than me today!
I only know one person from Minnesota, and he's a hugger. Where's Melissa today? She's from Minnesota!
Funny, me Mum is not a hugger. My dad was the occassional hugger. I don't hug without provocation. Hel was born needing a hug. It just provokes me to hug her!
;)
I'm fearless? Because I keep trying to hug Hel? Or because?
Maybe that is what attracted you to writing in the first place? Since writing is “mentally intimate” but physically distant.
No, pretty sure it was that in my stories, the ugly duckling always got the hot guy and got to make out with him all the time. Totally trying to rewrite my current predicament or history.
I'm not a hugger because I come from a family of NON-HUGGERS. Glowering was our way of exchanging family affection, complete with barking, "What do you think you're doing? Get in the house!" That's how you knew you were loved. You were glared and yelled at all the time.
Well, at least she's good about "NO RULES!"--that's something.
Yeah to Dee. You'll have it written by May. That's how I got my GOGU written, her harping to send her pages. It'll be good.
I cooed in her ear ‘The next part of this move is to snap your neck…”
Please, please teach me this move. I need it.
Because there’s such a huge discrepancy, it’s easier to play up the inside and contrast it to the outside.
I love this sort of foiling in novels. It's hilarious and totally amps up the conflict between the characters. Since the man would be dumb enough to actually think everything was fine.
I only know one person from Minnesota, and he’s a hugger. Where’s Melissa today? She’s from Minnesota!
Huh. I wouldn't have thought so. I would have thought being holed up with old man winter all the time would have made them reticent in their personalities, but maybe it has the opposite effect on them: they're so damned happy to see someone after being snowed in for 6 months, they'll just hug everyone in celebration that it's no longer snowing.
My dad was the occassional hugger.
Mine's not a hugger. On the whole. But he's gotten more huggy in his later years. I was saying goodbye to him the other day with my usual kiss on the cheek and "love you", which is usually the most affection we exchange, and he actually reached out and pawed at my side like he'd been expecting a hug too, but I'd already been breaking away. I was so flabbergasted I didn't know what to do.
I imagine he gets it from Mandie, my niece, she's a HUGGER. And I'll hug her. I'll hug her when she comes in the door and in the kitchen and twice when she leaves. She has some vibe where you're more than willing to go around hugging her.
Running through, so no time to read all the responses. At first, I kept much of myself out of my stories because I feared readers would see right through the words and know they were my secrets. Now, I really don't care. Many of my secrets (family ones too) are so way out there that most anyone reading them would think they are made up. That is unless they experienced them too.
Many of my secrets (family ones too) are so way out there that most anyone reading them would think they are made up.
Mark Twain frequently said the truth was stranger than fiction. I'm waiting for the day I just don't care. It probably just depends on who I think is doing the reading. I have to reassure myself that most of the people I'd fear most, can't read anyway.
Fiction is obliged to stick to possibilities. Truth isn't.
Mark Twain
Thanks for doing a drive by!
Please, please teach me this move. I need it.
All it takes is a little practice Grasshopper … Years and years ago when I was a kid we played a game called The Victim & the Perpetrator. The game started when the boy next door decided that he wanted to be a cop when he grew up. So he started doing research, research that included reading a book written by Bruce Lee. The book was either “Chinese Gung-Fu: The Philosophical Art of Self Defense” or “Tao of Jeet Kune Do”. My friend ( I’ll call him Jake) was intrigued by Lee’s theories of self defense, Especially those that stated that anyone could protect themselves from a larger, more aggressive attacker. Anyone could protect themselves as long as they were trained in certain, basic techniques? Even women even… gasp … Girls? Jake tested Lee’s theories using the smallest girls he could find. Which ended up being my older sister and i. Since I was the youngest I got to be the Victim. So I spent the summer learning moves to thwart The Perpetrator, aka my older sister. Can you imagine how much fun it was to thwart the attacks of a sibling, An older sibling? TOoooo fun.
Epilogue:
Jake was ten when he decided that he wanted to be a policeman. He became a martial arts expert, a cop, and now he is the commander of a very large police department.
My older sister is still tiny. And still just as dangerous.
Twice in my life I used Lee’s self defense techniques. The movements came to me without consciously thinking about them. I just did them. Had I not done them I am fairly sure that I would be dead … Funny how a gun pressed into your back can bring back the memories, the games, that you played in your childhood.
Speaking of stranger than fiction, found out yesterday my cousin became a grandmother when her 19yr old twin had a baby this weekend. The other twin is expecting in April.
Same father for both babies.
Can we say EEYEW?
Seriously? This man isn't dead for playing both these twins, or did they know they were "dating" the same guy?
Also screws up the whole first cousin thing. Can you imagine if something like that happened in royalty lineups? You can marry your first cousin you're a royal...but what if your first cousin was also your half brother?
Eeeewwwww1
I love how our conversations go all over.
Sorry I'm late folks, had a doc's appt this morning and then had a nap. That's how exciting I am.
But, let's see...
Battered or baked? As long as it's deep fried, I'm happy. I've been looking for a fish fry since I'm moved to NJ and I haven't been about to find one. In Western PA, where I grew up, you couldn't stumble around on a Friday without hearing about one. I miss them. I was just looking for one this weekend and I haven't heard of any. What's wrong with these folks?
Long John Silvers? YUMMMMmmmm.... A definite childhood memory.
As for Deep POV, I agree with Hal, that it's easier when someone points it out where you need it. She just did a chapter for me and it really helped me to get to know my heroine a little better. And it's true, the end that stuff comes easier, I think. I can see why some authors write entire drafts and just throw them away. I feel like I only know my characters after I've finished the story. Not convenient.
I confess, I'm a hugger. A big hugger. From a family of big huggers. Raising another big lovey hugger. I hug everyone. I will remember when I meet the rest of you folks that most of you are not big huggers. I apologize in advance if I intrude on anyone's personal space. It's part of my charm, I assure you.
And two twins having kids to the same guy? I second Julie's eeeewww....
I want a nap, and I don't have an excuse as good as incubating to justify one.
I have some honey roasted macadamian nuts though, so that's sorta making up for the fact I will not be getting a nap. They're crack.
As for Deep POV, I agree with Hal, that it’s easier when someone points it out where you need it.
I think most things are easier seen when someone else points them out to you. Though it helps if the person pointing them out is your critique partner, who only wants your story to be better, and not your husband, who thinks you haven't used every opportunity available for them to be having sex. And after all, a real man WOULD be thinking about it.
LOL! It definitely is better when it's a critique partner. Especially a critique partner who does Deep POV as well as Hal does. :)
And Honey Roasted Macadamia nuts? That sounds well, awesome. What brand of nut is that?
Eeeewww, eeeewww--once for each twin.
I'm a hugger too; I come from a long line of huggers, but we are discriminating huggers. We don't like out space being invaded by strangers and casual acquaintances. I picked up the five-year-old grand at school last spring. A less discriminating classmate tried to hug him goodbye. M held him off and said firmly, "No hugs, J. NO HUGS! See you tomorrow." :)
Janga - ahahaah!! That's too cute. :)
It's almost frightening how much of an extrovert my little man can be. He'll talk to people in the grocery store, he walks up to random kids on the playground and pronounces them the best of friends. I'm like, do you even know his name? LOL! It's good though. He never seems to have any social anxiety.
http://www.maunaloa.com/
This is them. I might have to buy some for my own. *LOL*
Ooooh I want a nap and some honey roasted macadamian nuts and I wanna explain something too. .... “I’m not a madman!” That’s what I always think when you say you’re not a writer. There are all kinds of writers. Not just the delusional “I want to publish” kind.
I say that i'm not a Writer precisely because I am not Delusional, Hellion. Writers follow writing rules. They plot and craft. I too plot, but instead of crafting I carve. I slice and dice and serve up little bits of my life. Like a chef. There is a difference in what we do. Because I do not follow any recipies ... any rules. And I feel that it would be disrespectful of me to claim that I am something that I am not. Especially when I see how hard you writers work to set such high writing standads for yourselves.
I am not a Madman, Hellon.
I am simply ... an Honest woman.
Writers follow writing rules.
No. How many people on this ship, actively writing with the intent to publish? 8? 10? (God, it's sad I can't count.) Every last one of them ignores at least one or more rules. Or if their name is Sin, they ignore EVERY rule. Some others ignore all the rules, but are vocal about it (whereas Sin just acts like she never heard you...and let's be real, she probably didn't. Take the speakers out of your ears, Sin!)
At least half of the writers here do not plot and if you accuse them of plotting, they will behead you.
You are a madman, Jules. You're very much a madman. It's all the Byzantine blood.
It’s all the Byzantine blood.
Quite true.
Nothing is ever simple with us.
And maybe I am Mad , Hellion. since only A Madman would tell you that "I love it when you teach me something , Hellion ,and then you say But I'm Not a Teacher!"
Touche. *LOL*
Everyone is a writer just like everyone is a teacher. After all, someone can just be here to serve as a warning of how not to be. That is teaching by example. And I've always wanted to serve as a horrible warning.
In this regard, then, you must be a writer.
After all, someone can just be here to serve as a warning of how not to be. That is teaching by example ...In this regard, then, you must be a writer.
That's it! I have finally found The Meaning To My Life ... I AM A Horrible Warning!
Call me Jule's The Horrible
or
The Horr for short! ;)
Damn it. Need to get out to the car for the shamwow again.
*wipe
*wipe
There, better now. Man, just merrily moving on, contemplating how I'll respond to I don't come from a family of huggers to the very idea of writing rules to a sudden dead stop at The Horr.
Hel, just because you don't come from a hugging family and don't like hugs doesn't mean you don't need a hug. But don't worry, I'm actually much better at cyber hubs than actual physical hugs.
I'm just too damned polite in person.
I've noticed a tendancy for the blog to consider my comments duplicates later in the day... Hel? You seetting this up to stymie my later day attempts to board the ship? ;)
Deep POV. Sigh. I think I get it. I think I write it...and I'm told I'm distant. I wonder...can I do deep point of view through a spyglass? You know, close up to the eye without all the diving into exploring the pores?
Yes. I am a spyglass writer.
In case it decides to let the earlier post post.
Oh, I love that Jules pulled the teacher card. Too funny. And just to out her for once and for all, when Hellie showed up at the airport, Tiff hugged her. There was no stiff arming. No beatings. She hugged back.
And then she turned and hugged me.
There, the truth is out.
Oh, and I think the twins willingly did the same guy. They've changed their story more than once, so who knows if it's the same guy or not. No idea if they plan to do paternity tests eventually.
Bo'sun, see if you ever get a hug again.
And now I'm really going: "Ewww, ewww, ewww, ewww" at the twin story. WTF! What is wrong with people?
2nd: that's good. You keep on being polite.
I don't think you need to go so deep into POV we're contemplating pores. Unless it's a middle-aged woman who's looking into one of those 5x mirrors and freaking out that her skin looks like hell. And that she looks ever minute of her 39 years. Then it might be appropriate.
In a story about surviving in a primitive land, pores are probably less important.
You win, Jules, you're completely incorrigible.
39 is middle-aged?!
Holy Hell.
Well, it depends on who you are. My mom died at age 68--so 34 would be middle age. My dad is 88 and is holding up well, so we might be able to move that up to 50. Depends on how good your genes are.
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