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Fitting Characters into a Plot or Fitting Plot with the Characters
I’m a plotter. It’s not really a secret around here. I’m one of those annoying folks who write a synopsis before I start writing my story. After I get it done, I map out all the scenes in the story and only when done do I feel like I’m prepared to write my story. I spend two weeks, maybe three, devoted to this whole process. Then I start writing.
Usually my storyline comes from character ideas. I got the idea for my last story from my heroine, a prophet, and the rest of the storyline exploded from there.
But in both of my last manuscripts, I’ve gotten to the middle and had to reevaluate my character motivations. I realized that I do this because I don’t “know” my characters as well in the beginning of the story so I have to go back through and revise after I know them better.
I admit this is inefficient. I revised my last manuscript at the middle and then revised it again at the end. Twice. I’m still not certain I’ve expressed what I want to express adequately.
Now, as I begin again, I’m reevaluating my method. Oh, relax folks. Never fear. I’m not going to chuck my plotting ways. I’m not ready to go all pantser on you guys. (I suspect I would make everyone—including myself—crazy).
But there might be something to be said for the pantsers who claim to focus on characters first and then let the story evolve naturally. Don’t get me wrong. I couldn’t just start writing with only an inkling of their personalities. But I do think I need to do more character development before I start this time. And not just for my hero and heroine, but for all the major characters. Then I can devise the plot after I know the people involved.
In an effort to attempt this feat, I’ve purposely ignored any attempts my brain has made to latch onto a plot direction. I jotted down disjointed ideas, but I’m going to wait until I’ve got the characters to do all that stuff.
Is this coming naturally? No. For something that should be organic (i.e., defining the characters in my head, answer their “whys” and “what fors”), it’s not easy. But when I let them unfold on the page by themselves and try to fit themselves into a storyline, I cause myself some serious heart aches in the middle and the end. So I’m hacking away at it. I’m questioning every little nuance about them that comes to my mind.
Are they annoyed with me? Yes. Am I annoyed with me? Absolutely. But I hope that it works better for the story in the end.
So tell me… What kind of character development things did you do to get to know your characters? Do they spring full formed to your mind or do you take a while to “learn” about them? Which comes easier—the characters or the plot?
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37 comments:
I think I have found a nice balance between plotting ahead of time and giving my characters a chance to develop with the flow of the story.
Instead of detailed plots for the book that outline each scene, I write a really loose, point form list of what I "want" the main turning points to be, and then I start writing and let the characters get to that point however they can based on the development of their personalities, baggage, etc.
JK - that's interesting. Sorta pantsing with a plotting skeleton.
So you are one who lets your characters develop on their own through the story? Do you ever have problems with conflicting motivations?
For me, it starts with characters. They are in my head before I have any idea of where they're going. I write biographies for them, highly detailed for the major characters. All my GMC comes from what emerges in those biographies.
I probably sound like a broken record on this, but character interviews are invaluable to me. Questions from others make me aware of what I still need to know about my characters.
Janga - I think that was what I was trying to get at today (in my long and rambly post above). Getting to the know my characters before (I hope) will help me get at my GMC easier.
And I like what JK says, that it's got to be a balance, of course. I'm just trying to figure out how to get at that balance I guess.
After you know your characters, Janga, are you more of a plotter or pantser from there?
Strictly a panster, Marnee. I don't even write lineraly. The result is that things go well in the beginning, and then I agonize through the stitch-together sections.
Marnee, I just read Jessica faust's blog today. It fits right in with this conversation.
http://bookendslitagency.blogspot.com/
:) Cool! Though I never know how you guys who don't write linearly do it. I'd make myself insane. I even follow recipes in order. I'm not equipped for that kind of spontaneity. LOL!
Janga - thanks for the post! :) But of course, the fabulous Jessica Faust said it all better than I could have. LOL!
Hmm, well two manuscripts finished the "wrong" way doesn't seem too bad. :) Maybe just expect the headaches?
I tried to change my process a bit this time and probably did the reverse; more plotting less pantsing. But I kept hitting dead ends. I think I finally realize that some solutions will stay hidden unless I write it out. In Hellie's words:
Don’t overthink it; just write what you know now and work through it. I find my brain likes to keep secrets from me and it’s better if I just trust it to know what’s going on more than I do. I’m just here to transcribe the dictation.
That works better for me. It's a bit of JK's balance of a main turning point [the what I know now], but letting the characters play it out.
I think characters will change no matter what the process. I know my heroine in my story goes from very fragile to very proactive in her character arc, but in the original version I had none of the (second half) proactive scenes in mind. Once that changed in the midpoint then the beginning changed. She still was fragile but there were hints of her wanting to change that wasn't there before. It surprised me that I didn't know her as well as I thought. It was the hero all the way and I guess she was along for the ride. But when her motivations changed, the hero's didn't. In a way, that gave me my conflict.
Maybe character biographies would have helped, but I'm not sure. She just didn't turn out the way I thought.
Either way, I still think you're being very productive doing just as you have been!
Hmmm. When I plantser, I don't get all GMC about my characters (though I should, but I get all bound up when I try), but I do write out the first scene where I meet my character. It doesn't have to be the opening scene, but it's the scene where that character is most vivid.
Then I look at that scene and I try to figure out: What is WRONG with this person? Why are they unhappy and what would make them happy?
The why they are unhappy usually is from godawful family that they don't want to talk about much...or a tramatic childhood of Bridget Jones in High School proportions, and I understand. We chat awhile and I realize, they're just garden-variety neurotic.
So we visit a bit more and I try to determine what is the WORST thing that could happen to this person? Because, well, most of our fears stem from childhood and so that abandonment issues or public humilation bit, it's gotta be big--so what's the WORST THAT COULD HAPPEN?
And if that is something that sounds like a Black Moment, I go, Cool, and try to stick that at the end. So I have my character with the crappy past and the Black Moment looming somewhere--and I look at the blank space in the middle and go: Okay, what would need to happen between here (where she refuses to do anything of this sort) to here (where clearly she did something to where it all falls apart)--and try to piece together a probably course of action.
It's not really plotting though--because I don't ask the majority of those screw ball questions they have on questionaires. I ask questions that have to do with the situation of my character at the time.
I don't mind not knowing everything about my character at the start. It's impossible to know everything about my character at the start, as impossible as knowing everything about my boyfriend or best friend from 3rd grade...or even myself. I've even been known to surprise myself...and if I can surprise myself, then my characters can do it without trying.
So you are one who lets your characters develop on their own through the story? Do you ever have problems with conflicting motivations?
This isn't my question, but I like it. I think you can bypass most conflicting motivations by figuring out the character's "motto" in the beginning. I think you don't have to know everything about a character, but I think if you know their basic mode-of-operation in life (motto), you'll have their motivation for doing just about anything. Like if their motto is "don't get involved, you'll only get hurt"--you have a character that will be bitchy and do just about anything to get rid of the other character, just so they don't have to get involved. (Incidentally that's a lot of romantic suspense heroes right there, but you'll notice most RS heroes have a conflicting personality quirk of being "noble" and "honorable" so even as they're trying to get rid of you, they can't bring themselves to let you save yourself if you're really in trouble.) I think it's perfectly normal for a character to have both good and bad/noble and selfish qualities operating at the same time. That's all of us, isn't it?
I think so long as in your story, when you're in their POV, you're showing how conflicted they are, wanting to keep their distance but bound to help them anyway...it works out. The reader believes it too.
Right now I'm plotting the demise of several co-workers. Will try to return if I don't get arrested after the black moment.
It's black. Very black.
Sounds like we best start a legal defense fund fer the Bo'sun...
I pants...and I end up wit' needin' deep revisions and tons a' rewritin'. Wit' this latest, I tried somethin' a bit different. I wrote a summation 'bout the world and the characters. Didn't go inta depth about them, but it touched on their strongest characteristics. It were several pages long and I actually added ta it as I kept writin'.
They still surprised me as I went along. And after me mentor read a sample...her observation struck gold fer me. Me first draft be basically a phenomenal thick outline... I actually like that idea and am more than willin' ta dive back inta the MS and plump/primp/clean-up...ya name it.
Me characters always surprise me... I think me books start wit' characters and the world. Plot stumbles along, and sometimes suffers. But that be what the revision is for.
I do hope as I learn more, that it becomes easier, wit' less revision... I'd rather find me mistakes as I go than 'ave ta dig 'em out... But if this becomes the way I go, than that is the way I go!
Janga - jinx :)
I love this blog, Marn. I'm currently struggling with the same thing. For me, I've just been free-writing in the character's POV. I can't write 1st person to save my life, so I do close 3rd, but the point is I just write. Their thoughts, their fears, their desires, their histories. I write it in their tone, their mind-set.
It probably will never be used, but there are a few gems I've pulled out. I only started doing it because I needed words for NaNo, but I really love it, and I think I'll keep doing it until I really know the characters.
Jessica Faust (Bookends) posted a great, similar blog today:
The truth is that there is no perfect way to write a book. Nearly every author I talk with looks at a critique partner or friend and wishes she could write like that. Someone else always makes it look easy, especially when they manage to tackle what we most struggle with. Writing is creative, writing a book is a creative process, and when it comes to creativity there is no perfect answer to how it should be done.
There’s no doubt we can always seek to improve ourselves and the way we do things, and while I would urge you to do that, I would also urge you to embrace your process, the highs and the lows. No one writes a book with ease. We all struggle at certain moments, but sometimes those struggles are exactly what bring us our best ideas.
Marnee, I love the plotting, panster topics. I fit neither of these molds. I am a true puzzler! I write out little scenes or chapters, not always in order and then somehow I weave them together at one point to be a finished book. It's not always fool proof, but for some reason it is just the way my mind works. It is like I get an idea for the day, but it may not be where I would be in the book, so I start to write it down and pretty soon I have this chapter done! I never understood it until the RT convention when an author pointed it out and told me, thats how she writes also! I just thought I was disorganized! LOL!!!
Jane never be disorganized... Messy, maybe. But not disorganized!
Me first draft be basically a phenomenal thick outline…
Me too, Chance. I think I'll use this outline the more I write. It seems to be a catchall for a lot of random thoughts too.
Oh, I wish the words came easy. I almost think it might be interesting to give dictation a try for a first draft. This thought came to me when I found an old craft book (How to Write a Romance, Kathryn Falk 1980) and read an interview with Barbara Cartland.
Picture this. (Footnote from interview.)
Barbara Cartland always lies on a couch with her dogs at her feet and her secretary sitting behind her because she finds it distracts her to see anyone while she is concentrating.
She advised, "when writing for entertainment, always dictate. Otherwise one becomes too pompous. Also, it's easy when you're sitting down with a blank piece of paper to think, "I'll just add extra words, extra adjectives, extra descriptions."
I can't imagine dictating, but I'm curious to give it a try! It migh be interesting for a speedy rough draft. It sounds very wrong to say, but Barbara Cartland definitely vomited out her novels. She wrote (dictated) about two novels a month!
Sorry for the delay guys. I had to wait in a doctor's office for 2.5 hours to get an ultrasound!!! And they wouldn't let me pee! I swear, that's like torture to a pregnant woman.... I'm writing a nasty letter.
Melissa - I think there's a lot of truth to the, some things will remain hidden until I write them out, suggestion you made. I suspect that there's going to be some level of revelation throughout the story unraveling, but I was just hoping that if there was a way to make things more cohesive, then I would try to seek it out. :)
Hells - I like your questions! And the way you approach getting to know your characters.... I think maybe I should consider growing my plots around character development. That might help me.
Hell - I also love the idea of focusing on their mottos. That's a good idea. Hmmm... lots to think about for my next h/h.
Bo'sun - hope no one died today....
Chance - so you're a "characters first" and plot as I go, sort. I think if I did that, I'd definitely need to do as you suggest--revise A LOT at the end. Or I'd ramble on forever and end up cutting huge huge chunks at the end.
If I were a less impatient person, I suspect this wouldn't bother me. But now, the idea of chopping big chunks in revision causes me physical pain. Perhaps why I need to plot in the beginning. LOL!!
Hal - I like the idea of free-writing in their POV. Though I'm afraid I would try to hard to incorporate what I wrote. I do think that if I did it of their pasts or sort of like their diary entries, that might work out for me. Maybe that's something to think of. Finding major dark moments in their lives and trying to delve deep into those emotions. Very cool idea.
:)
Jane - Wow, I think that sounds fascinating. I'm way to linear thought oriented. But that's a really cool way to do it.
I say as long as it works, have at it!! :)
Melissa - SO Barbara Cartland just talked her novels out?! And then someone typed it up? Dude, I need a secretary!! I could totally do that!! :) LOL!!
Seriously though, I wonder how much different a story would sound from dictation versus written out? Would be an interesting experiment. Let us know how it goes, Melissa.
Considerin' I've heard that it's good ta read yer MS aloud as ya revise...dictatin' would be like hittin' that stage early? I'd love ta try that! There be software that can work that way... Hmmmm!
Yeah, I could just see myself adding another step by writing out what I would THEN dictate. LOL
My thinking is that it would be difficult because you'd still get stuck on the plot, but maybe you'd at least get most of it out and it would get easier with practice. I do think it's possible to tell a story out loud. Maybe it would be entertaining in a multiple personality kind of one person show! LOL Whoa, what an image! What would be most difficult? Switching POV, the back and forth dialogue? I think the description would be easier. Barbara Cartland actually said every background or setting she described was from a real experience. I'm surprised she didn't have her secretary following her around! LOL
I'll pass the baton on to you, Chance. Try it and let us know how it goes. :)
Sorry it took me so long to get back. I've been following along when I could.
My stories come completely out of the characters. Which is why I have a terrible time creating sustainable conflict. When I first started writing, I had the hardest time figuring out how characters would react to different situations. But I've gotten better at knowing pretty quick what s/he would say or do in most cases.
Since I don't seem able to wrap my head around GMC, I was happy to find a blog by Jenny Crusie about something called the conflict box. Though I may pull my hair out when it gets to revisions, I plan on using this technique to help me bring things around.
http://www.arghink.com/2009/10/20/conflict-box/
Do we need ta send the bail money anywhere special, Bo'sun?
Chance - there's something that you can dictate to and it'll type it out!? Tell me more!!
Melissa - I suspect that BC culd have afforded to have someone just follow her around. Man, what a cool job. LOL!!
B'sun - Thanks for the link!
I'm kinda getting the feeling that a lot of us either focus on character and then deal with plot issues in revision or focus on plot and deal with character inconsistencies later. Is this a pick your poison thing? Or we just sort of decide which fits our personality better?
Just wondering. I keep hearing pantsers saying they start at character and go from there. I kinda go the other way. I was just curious. (Stinking, "i gots to understand everything" tendencies....)
I thinks I generally start with characters. But I also tend ta see the world I'm creatin' as a character...not that I explain it well, but it be in me head.
I'm workin' a revision right now that be massive...straightenin' out floatin' POV, and diggin' deeper inta the emotional conflicts a' the main characters. If I knew me characters from the start and went wit' them, I'd not need that part revised...I think. I pants from straight blindness, I think.
In general, I think a' the world first. Not the plot, not the characters...but the world and its rules, or lack a' rules...then the characters start showin' up and generally challenge most everythin' I thought I knew 'bout this world...
I think wit' straight romance, it works different. The conflict always be between characters...even fer the Bo'sun who frets 'bout not havin' 'nuff conflict wit' her people. (Define 'nuff! That be the key, Bo'sun.)
But I also worry 'bout understandin' it too much. I be a supersticious sort who fears understandin' it too much might make the magic fade.
And yeah, somethin' called Dragon software, I think be the name. It takes dictation, a' some sort!
Where do you go for your ultrasounds, Marn? The Spanish Inquisition of Gynocology?
I'm glad you liked my questions. *grins* As Erma Bombeck says, "The grass is always greener over the septic tank." I love the Jessica blog today--very relevant. I hate my way of plotting most days and wish I was the kind that outlined more or was able to answer real questions.
But I think all ways are worth trying at least once to see if they're fun. And writing should be fun, damnit. *LOL*
I could not have a secretary. He/she would interfere with my Farm Town Facebook addiction as they constantly remind me I'm paying them by the hour. Plus I have a little dictation recording device, and I couldn't do it. I'm sure it just takes practice--but I hate my voice playing back at me. Ugh.
Plot vs Character--I think most writers are either or about this. I know there are other writers who say they think of the plot first--and the books were good and they were published, so it can't be all bad.
I think a story can come from either. For me, I prefer to come up with the character first--or the character shows up right before thinking of the situation they are (the plot) in, so it's not like I had a character and then I sat around wondering what plot best fit them. They practically showed up together; I just happen to technically think of the character first. I figure it's because I'm more interested in WHY somebody did something than I am about the something itself.
It's why I loved history class: I was always more interested in speculating WHY Napoleon thought he could be ruler of the world than the HOW it occurred. But I think lots of writers focus more on HOW something happened. I think the WHYS and the HOWS get to the same ending, but it's just different road trips. One's more scenic; the other is the more direct route.
I think it is called Dragon software. My boss has it. It sometimes misspells words on him. You have to do cleanups. Also, when not in use...can be entertaining. For instance if I go to my boss's office, and ask him a question--and he answers, then whatever he says in answer to me is also added to whatever document he's working on. This is esp annoying if we're not paying attention and we start talking about baseball or something.
Chance - The world as a character. What an interesting take on it! I think that's true. Particularly with paranormal. Even if the paranormal element isn't all encompassing, a writer has to explain how that paranormal element redefines the world as we know it. Very cool....
Hells - This wasn't even my doctor! I needed to get the sequential screening (some recent test for Downs and some other chromosome disorder). It doesn't really matter as I wouldn't do anything different even if I amhaving a Downs baby, but it'd be nice to know, to prepare care and whatever. But my doctor doesn't offer the screening. Instead, they referred me somewhere else and that wait was brutal. I'm writing a letter. Seriously. 2.5 hours is beyond ridiculous.
That said.... On to your real thoughts.... LOL!!
I agree that everything's worth trying once. I figure it can't hurt to find out if it works or not for me.
The whole listening to your voice definitely is a problem. I don't like my voice on recording either. Hmmm.... I think it'd be fine if the software just typed for me though. I'd never have to hear my voice.
I agree that it's either or, probably. I'd like to be both. You think that's possible?
I don't know that the character or plot method is a conscious decision. I never know when a story is going to show up and so far, they've always come as one or two characters and they sort of let me in on their scenario.
For instance, when my Ocracoke story showed up, the three main characters arrived in my head, the hero told me how he met the heroine, the heroine let me know she's engaged to the hero's brother, and a bit of backstory about the hero being hurt before when a woman chose moving away to staying with him on the island he loved.
All that just showed up. And I still haven't written that story. Hopefully, I'll start Joe & Julianne's story later next year. Who knows, maybe that'll be next years NaNo book. LOL!
You're welcome for the link! And I can just see Cartland spread out on her fancy chaise, pooches at her feet, and feathered boa around her neck. Behind her is a harried secretary bent over a typewriter trying to get her glasses to stay up on her nose. I sure hope the poor thing wasn't allergic to the dogs.
Ter - LOL! I love the visual of BC. LOL!!
And I think you're right; we just all start at this in our own way.
I think authors can be both--and there are examples of authors who do it both ways, but there is usually one way that is more dominant for them.
I'm sure you'll come up with stories someday that are characters first--and you won't even have to "work" at it. They'll just show up and tell you what their plot is.
Marn - I got hassled 10 years ago because I wouldn't have that test done. I just didn't believe in knowing that ahead of time. Not that someone else shouldn't be able to, but they shouldn't force it IMO. Of course, I didn't even find out the sex ahead of time, I liked the surprise element.
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