Tuesday, September 1, 2009
Of Vice and Virtue
PS. There is nothing virtuous about me.
Drugs- Adakain- Tears of Dysphoria
This song is a repeater for me.
I read a seriously fantastical book over the weekend- ADDICTED by Charlotte Featherstone.
For the August meeting, Hellie had me over (the infamous furniture shopping escapade) and before we ventured out into public, we sat on the couch and talked writing. Our allotted five minutes of writing talk before we move on to other things and there was this beautifully covered book sitting on her coffee table. I snatched up the book and flipped it over. Then I told Hellie she needed to take it back to the library so that I could check it out.
I put it on hold; she took it back, now I have my greedy little hands on it. The book is classified as an Erotic Novel, and I must agree. The scenes are *HOT*, but the underlying message and romance of the novel weaves you into the world. Instead of reading about two characters having unbelievably hot sex, you're reading about their passion and love for one another. I totally dig that.
The prologue is so profound. The words wrapped around me like thick incense bent on relaxing me to the core. I felt as though I was the one laying in an opulent opium den, smoke heavy in the air, mind pleasantly numb. You can taste the smoke as it rolls off your tongue, so sweet yet so bittersweet. You can feel it filling you, and the way your body reacts to it, nothing short of heaven. The rapture, the feeling of absolution. I can feel it even as I type these words to you. Ms. Featherstone's description is nothing short of erotically poetic as she weaves you into this world of unknown pleasure and addiction.
"They say my lover is a sinister beauty, and perhaps they are correct. But when caught in her heady embrace there is nothing sinister about her." (Prologue, ADDICTED)
I read many a review about this book before I started reading it. Lots of reviews about how Ms. Featherstone writes this book as though she was meant to speak out to addicts. There were points in this book that were so painful to read that it took everything I had not to break down and cry. I even admit that I had a few tears escape a couple of times.
Okay, so I cried. WTF. I think there might be something wrong with me. But it's hard not to when there are conversations like this, "I know that a soul is something I don't have, and love... love is like ghosts, something that everyone talks of but few have seen."(Pg 362, ADDICTED)
I couldn't put this book down. ADDICTED was filled with ups and downs and moments of utter despair among the hero and heroine. I found myself so wound up in the lives of these characters that it was all I could do to put the book down and NOT think about what would come next.
We all know I love angst. My inner teenager gleefully slits her wrists to emo music at the opportunity to read about despair and anguish. I must just talk in general about the whole tone of the book. Everyone can remember their first love. The feeling of euphoria when you realize your love is returned. The joy you feel when your life suddenly is more than puppies, kittens and rainbows and is about another person. But there is a downside to the high you feel in love when the love turns sour. When something happens to question that love, to question everything you believed and loved about your partner ultimately becomes something destructive. And even when you can forgive someone for the past, you can't forgive yourself. Life is complicated, life with someone else is hard without dealing with the past, but life when lying about it is not life, it's a ghost, a shadow hanging around to follow you everywhere you go.
The single most painful moment in your life is when you lose someone you love with all your heart and soul. The second most painful is after you lose them, they come back and you have to find a way to lie about how much you really love them.
This book is filled with moments that are so lifelike and difficult and so very rewarding at the end. The characters have a quality of realness that you can relate to as a reader. You may think the main story line is only the addiction. The addiction is only one part of the story. Addiction is one of the most universal things in the world. You don't have to be a drug addict to understand addiction. Addiction can happen in any facet of life. Love is one of the easiest things to become addicted to- the feeling, the emotional high- it's just something you never forget once you have it. And when you live without it, you crave it. That is what addiction is. You get a taste of something, over and over again, and then you must have it. You'll do anything to have it. Give up anything. Give anything. Be anyone. Even for a little taste.
I'm fond of vices in a character. I think it gives the reader something to identify with. Makes the character more real in their mind. If you have a character that's ultimately the perfect person, who never makes a mistake, not many people can identify with that. Never skinny dipped in a state park. Never gotten into trouble. Never tasted liquor on Sundays. Never had a one night stand- I mean the list can go on and on. (Ever taken one of those survey/quiz thingys where you have to figure up what your bail would be based on the crap you've done in your past? Seriously, um, no one should EVER see mine.) People need options to identify with to spellbind them to the story line and make them keep reading (besides the great story you're telling.)
Some vices are easy to redeem a character for and some, well, others are hard to forgive. Sadie is a pill binger. The hardest thing for me to write with Sadie is when she's feeling those pains of withdrawal. There is a difference between numbing yourself out with a stimulant and the cold numbing sweat of desperation. The way her skin crawls. The way her whole body shakes and her teeth chatter. Her hands tremor uncontrollably as she tries to pick herself up. Her voice is weak, throat raw from dry heaving. The dark circles underneath her eyes, the nubbed fingernails, her cracked lips as she lays curled into a ball on the floor and waits for sleep or death. But no one knows. No one knows her secret and she is very desperate to keep it that way.
Kiki's vice is trust. She trusts no one. And that may seem easily redeemable, but without trust, every relationship is doomed- friends, more than friends. Doesn't matter. You can't live life without it.
Let's talk vices. Do you like vice themed books? What is a typical vice of a hero and heroine and which vice is your favorite to see redeemed? What about your own vices? Anyone willing to admit that they have one?
PS. I'm excited to say that I'll get to read about Lord Wallingford in Ms. Featherstone's next book, SINFUL. I can't wait! He's the baddest of all bad boys. I heart him completely. And it's meant to be. I mean his book is being named, SINFUL. I wrote the book on sin.
Drugs- Adakain- Tears of Dysphoria
This song is a repeater for me.
I read a seriously fantastical book over the weekend- ADDICTED by Charlotte Featherstone.
For the August meeting, Hellie had me over (the infamous furniture shopping escapade) and before we ventured out into public, we sat on the couch and talked writing. Our allotted five minutes of writing talk before we move on to other things and there was this beautifully covered book sitting on her coffee table. I snatched up the book and flipped it over. Then I told Hellie she needed to take it back to the library so that I could check it out.
I put it on hold; she took it back, now I have my greedy little hands on it. The book is classified as an Erotic Novel, and I must agree. The scenes are *HOT*, but the underlying message and romance of the novel weaves you into the world. Instead of reading about two characters having unbelievably hot sex, you're reading about their passion and love for one another. I totally dig that.
The prologue is so profound. The words wrapped around me like thick incense bent on relaxing me to the core. I felt as though I was the one laying in an opulent opium den, smoke heavy in the air, mind pleasantly numb. You can taste the smoke as it rolls off your tongue, so sweet yet so bittersweet. You can feel it filling you, and the way your body reacts to it, nothing short of heaven. The rapture, the feeling of absolution. I can feel it even as I type these words to you. Ms. Featherstone's description is nothing short of erotically poetic as she weaves you into this world of unknown pleasure and addiction.
"They say my lover is a sinister beauty, and perhaps they are correct. But when caught in her heady embrace there is nothing sinister about her." (Prologue, ADDICTED)
I read many a review about this book before I started reading it. Lots of reviews about how Ms. Featherstone writes this book as though she was meant to speak out to addicts. There were points in this book that were so painful to read that it took everything I had not to break down and cry. I even admit that I had a few tears escape a couple of times.
Okay, so I cried. WTF. I think there might be something wrong with me. But it's hard not to when there are conversations like this, "I know that a soul is something I don't have, and love... love is like ghosts, something that everyone talks of but few have seen."(Pg 362, ADDICTED)
I couldn't put this book down. ADDICTED was filled with ups and downs and moments of utter despair among the hero and heroine. I found myself so wound up in the lives of these characters that it was all I could do to put the book down and NOT think about what would come next.
We all know I love angst. My inner teenager gleefully slits her wrists to emo music at the opportunity to read about despair and anguish. I must just talk in general about the whole tone of the book. Everyone can remember their first love. The feeling of euphoria when you realize your love is returned. The joy you feel when your life suddenly is more than puppies, kittens and rainbows and is about another person. But there is a downside to the high you feel in love when the love turns sour. When something happens to question that love, to question everything you believed and loved about your partner ultimately becomes something destructive. And even when you can forgive someone for the past, you can't forgive yourself. Life is complicated, life with someone else is hard without dealing with the past, but life when lying about it is not life, it's a ghost, a shadow hanging around to follow you everywhere you go.
The single most painful moment in your life is when you lose someone you love with all your heart and soul. The second most painful is after you lose them, they come back and you have to find a way to lie about how much you really love them.
This book is filled with moments that are so lifelike and difficult and so very rewarding at the end. The characters have a quality of realness that you can relate to as a reader. You may think the main story line is only the addiction. The addiction is only one part of the story. Addiction is one of the most universal things in the world. You don't have to be a drug addict to understand addiction. Addiction can happen in any facet of life. Love is one of the easiest things to become addicted to- the feeling, the emotional high- it's just something you never forget once you have it. And when you live without it, you crave it. That is what addiction is. You get a taste of something, over and over again, and then you must have it. You'll do anything to have it. Give up anything. Give anything. Be anyone. Even for a little taste.
I'm fond of vices in a character. I think it gives the reader something to identify with. Makes the character more real in their mind. If you have a character that's ultimately the perfect person, who never makes a mistake, not many people can identify with that. Never skinny dipped in a state park. Never gotten into trouble. Never tasted liquor on Sundays. Never had a one night stand- I mean the list can go on and on. (Ever taken one of those survey/quiz thingys where you have to figure up what your bail would be based on the crap you've done in your past? Seriously, um, no one should EVER see mine.) People need options to identify with to spellbind them to the story line and make them keep reading (besides the great story you're telling.)
Some vices are easy to redeem a character for and some, well, others are hard to forgive. Sadie is a pill binger. The hardest thing for me to write with Sadie is when she's feeling those pains of withdrawal. There is a difference between numbing yourself out with a stimulant and the cold numbing sweat of desperation. The way her skin crawls. The way her whole body shakes and her teeth chatter. Her hands tremor uncontrollably as she tries to pick herself up. Her voice is weak, throat raw from dry heaving. The dark circles underneath her eyes, the nubbed fingernails, her cracked lips as she lays curled into a ball on the floor and waits for sleep or death. But no one knows. No one knows her secret and she is very desperate to keep it that way.
Kiki's vice is trust. She trusts no one. And that may seem easily redeemable, but without trust, every relationship is doomed- friends, more than friends. Doesn't matter. You can't live life without it.
Let's talk vices. Do you like vice themed books? What is a typical vice of a hero and heroine and which vice is your favorite to see redeemed? What about your own vices? Anyone willing to admit that they have one?
PS. I'm excited to say that I'll get to read about Lord Wallingford in Ms. Featherstone's next book, SINFUL. I can't wait! He's the baddest of all bad boys. I heart him completely. And it's meant to be. I mean his book is being named, SINFUL. I wrote the book on sin.
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77 comments:
Certainly sounds like an intriguin' book, Sin.
Ahem. I hate ta say in the bail game, they'd let me out on me own recognizance. Goody all shoes, that's me! Ask me sister.
Vices I likes ta see in my characters... Me Reynard lies. Always fer a good cause, but it's there. Another character is one a' those who doesn't lie, but doesn't share the truth... Upon reflection, most a' them don't share the truth.
And it is a vice I do love ta redeem. Teach 'em ta share themselves.
Sin, You always give 110%. What a treasure of interesting thoughts!
I never considered alcohol on Sundays to be a vice, so perhaps that excuses me.If you don't know that your pleasure is a vice then it can't be sinful to indulge.... right?
It seems that the items considered to be sinful are constantly changing. The early church persecuted people for defying doctrine...poor old Galileo. But now we have an ex-scientist turned priest (John Polkinghorne) trying to instill more spirituality into scientific thought and more scientific thinking into religion.
Witches were once burnt at the stake but now have become almost respectable.
Homosexuality was once considered beyond the pail, but now they can form partnerships in the marital sense .... though not yet get married in church. Just give it time!
The list is almost endless. So if you have a vice that you absolutely can't give up, then I say hang on a bit and write a few books arguing that it is really perfectly respectable. Perspectives may then change.
I don't think I have any really bad vices, certainly none that I would reveal here. Though I will admit to a certain naughty pleasure in tweaking Helli's tale. I'm trying hard to reform that one though!
Thanks for jump starting my neurons Sin. :D
PS Chance's post just appeared. The weirdness of electronics!
Chance, don't think I didn't notice your attempts to insult me the other day.
I'm turning the other cheek.....for now! *grin*
PPS Crumbs,perhaps a few neurons are still not firing properly!
Helli, I just want to add that I only tweak the tails of people that I admire, people with fire and backbone. Weird I know, but its the greatest compliment that I can give.
Shake hands? :)
Nice review. First good one on this book I've seen and it makes me want to pick it up.
She's got great covers...
Vices... great topic. Rothburn (first book) has many. And I like when a character has to overcome them and learn to deal with them. Asbury has no vices, he just likes everything to go according to planned. He's more anal than vice oriented, *snort*
And Q, homosexual's and lesbian's can get married in a church in Toronto, legally :) I think they can in Vermont, too. Soon people will come to their senses and allow it everywhere!
I don't believe I have any vices. I'm far too boring a person to indulge in immortal behaviour :)
That was immoral behaviour. Totally not awake yet.
I LOVE Charlotte Featherstone. I have a couple of her ebooks, and the woman is an amazing writer. I remember one night I needed something to read and nothing on the bookshelf appealed to me. I browsed some ebooks on the internet and discovered Ms Feathstone's work. I have Addicted on my TBR list, something to look forward to purchasing this weekend:) You're so right her prouse is like a drug, it tugs you under like a stron currant, and tosses you about until you float gradually back to reality.
I love books about vices. I really enjoyed James Frey's A Million Little Pieces. What a wild story about rehab from drug addiction. I know the book is controversial, but no matter if it's truth or not, it's an amazing read. You feel every moment of agony that he expieriences, it a is a very emotionally draining book to read, but sometimes I have to be emtionally drained from what I read to be totally satisfied.
Great blog!!!
Sorry so many misspells I'm in rush...as usual:)
Good mornin' all!
MM, I love a character who lies. Kiki's not much of a liar, but she omits the whole story. I think characters who play their cards close to their chests are the most fun to play with (especially when writing a series) because you have plenty of opportunities to make them sweat.
I love that. "Teach them to share themselves." Good thought!
Q, my dear, you sure know how to butter me up early in the morning, now don't you?
I'll let the liquor on Sunday slide for you, only because I know you're a gentleman and you need your bit of liquor to keep your uncivilized side tamed.
Everyone loves to tweak Hellie's tail. *g*
I'm gonna have to take cover. She'll come down the street and beat the crap out of me.
Tiff, she's got beautiful covers! I see her covers and think of you.
I'd love to have a bit of immortal behavior.
And I think that being anal retentive is a vice. It's not something you can completely overcome but you can work on making it a little less noticeable to the general public.
Hmmm... Vice books, huh? Not really a big thing for me. I didn't really like Phury's book and I think that's the only drug vice book I've read lately.
My characters? Hmmm.... Nik is addicted to being in charge. Sarah? If anything she's addicted to guilt. One of those girls who wants to take on everyone else's weighty decisions.
Great blog, Sin
Lisa :)
You described it so much better than me.
I have to admit that I haven't read many books that were centered on vices and overcoming them. Since the majority of my reads up until about three years ago was historical based only, I'm just now starting to branch out. I can't wait for SINFUL to come out. I think Wallingford will make the best story.
Great. Another opportunity for me to worry that my characters are boring. *sigh*
Great blog and great review. I'm going to have to check the library for this one. (I've put myself on a strict no buying diet.) Those are gorgeous covers, but I think I like the one for Sinful best.
Is being stubborn a vice? Celi is very stubborn. One of those "my mind is made up and you're not going to change it" things. Bryan is a bit OCD in that he needs organization and control over his environment. Not sure that's a vice so much as a character trait. He can be a bit narrow sighted and pushy when he wants something, but we'll have to see how that comes out further along.
Me? None. That's my story and I'm sticking to it.
Marn, I forgot about Phury's book. LOL Obviously not a book that stuck with me. I think he was more whiner than addict. Though, Rehv's book was a bit of an addict book. His was much better, IMHO.
Ter, if stubbornness is a vice then it is your crutch to bear as well.
Your characters are NOT boring. Jeez. I didn't write this blog to make you fret over the lack of drug induced spaceouts in your writing.
I agree. Rehv's book was better. :) And I think I didn't like Phury's book because there wasn't a really convincing love affair there. Rehv and Ehlena were more convincing.
And wait a minute... I don't have any drug induced spaceouts either....
*off to spike my coffee*
Yes, Marn, but you have Ice which is as close to a drug induced spaceout as you can get and not actually have one.
Oh... Ok, good. *breathing into my paper bag*
Hmmm, imperfection, yes, but vice, probably not high on the appeal. I hadn't really thought of imperfections as true vices. I guess its that control thing. I mean, I could see my hero as someone who gambles, a bad boy or regency rake, etc., but is his vice out of control? He might be surrounded by vice, but he's not consumed by it.
Secondary characters can have the vices - - they SHOULD have their vices, and the worse the more interesting, but my hero has to have that core of honor that sets him apart. Is that being a prude or judgmental? I certainly don't want HIM to be either.
I agree with Marni. Her character is addicted to being in charge, and I guess that in itself, needing to be in charge or in control, is a vice. Or simply an imperfection. :)
I feel an uncontrollable urge to be didactic. :)
Since I believe all vices stem from a failure to love properly (God, others and/or self), I think any character--real or fictional--will have vices, admitted or denied.
I think Kathryn Caskie's Seven Deadly Sins series is an interesting premise--seven siblings, each examplifying one of the big sins.
Melissa, I think what separates a vice and an imperfection is the degree to which the character takes it.
For me, if control is a vice, then the character is forceful in his regard to control, almost violent. Stubbornness? Must be so bad the character drives people away, beyond arrogant and detached.
Janga, I like your rationalization. Vices stem from something lacking in life. I can agree with that.
I've not read that series, but it sounds very intriguing. I might have to add it to the TBR pile.
Ok, I want a cover like that when I grow up into a published author! Holy smokes that thing jumps out at you!
I read a book a few months back that had a hero who was addicted to cutting. It wasn't hugely featured in the book, but it did play a role in showing him grow as a character. It was quite the epic story - one you pirates would love since he becomes one!
It's Broken Wing by Judith James. Not an easy story to read (as you'll see in the blurb) but wonderfully written and well...EPIC!
http://www.judithjamesauthor.com/books/bw/
Sabrina, were you the one who suggested that I read Shaken and Stirred? I did read it (last night as a matter of fact) and it was a really good quick read. I think my favorite part was about the older people who found each other after 60 years. Even if it's fictional, it warms my heart to think that would be possible. I would love to read a book just about WWII era couples that were torn apart and then find each other many moons down the road. That would be epic. Probably a Nicholas Sparks type of book. LOL
I will have to look into that book.
The uber-Alpha dudes are always control freaks. Which is why I find them so annoying. :)
I do think one of the reasons I have such a hard time creating conflict is because I make my characters too nice. They aren't perfect, but they aren't too bad either. When I first started this WIP back in 2007, they were just two young people attracted to each other and by page 80, the story was over. LOL!
At that point I realized, I should probably give them an obstacle or two.
Yep - Shaken and Stirred was good and I loved that older couple too! It is a great idea for a story. The book could have two parts - one of their young love and then the reunion later.
Ter, there is nothing wrong with nice characters. And it's hard to believe we both started on our WIP in 2007. I suck. I should be done by now.
I know! One of my favorite fan fiction pieces I ever wrote was about a war time era girl who was in love with a solider and he shipped off again and she found out she was pregnant. The character was just a minor character in the books, but I had this whole backstory for her in my head. I love those kind of stories. They should do one of those Chicken Soup books about stories like that.
It doesn't matter how long it takes to finish a WIP. It just matters that you keep going....
*hug* Awh, Marn.
Terri, oh, the dreaded middle! lol I had the same problem in my first WIP; the story over at about page 80. If I didn't do something drastic, they would either have to get together or go their separate ways. At that point, it was more logical that they went their separate ways, which isn't a great way to end a romance! I think with "nice" characters, it's likely they need a big external conflict. Then starts PART II. :)
I ranted last week to Hellie (where is she, btw?) that I should have had this damn thing done a LONG time ago. I admit this was inspired by a touch of jealousy (as Janga so eloquently blogs about on Just Janga) because a book slightly similar to mine is about to hit the shelves. You think "If only I'd finished it back then and polished it and sent it out, it could be hitting the shelves right now!"
But as she pointed out, I couldn't have written the book back then. I know a TON more about writing now than I did then. And I was sort of busy doing something else. She talked me off the ledge, but it was close. LOL!
Melissa - I was so clueless. LOL! They had no issues and the attraction was strong and the next thing I knew, he was ravishing her against the wall. I was like "Whoa! You two need to slow this crap down!"
LOL!
*Marnee, dragging her soapbox to the center of the deck*
Not to be all existential about this, but we all have our own paths. We'll follow them at our pace and we'll write the story of our hearts as our hearts give it to us.
Never taint your process--your growth--with regrets. "Their" book is not your book.
(Of course this is easier to say than to do. But I do think it's worth saying again and again to ourselves.)
*Jumps down from soapbox with a decided lack of grace and sits down on it, waving at a hottie for another drink*
Everything in it's own time. That's been my motto after a tough year.
I think we'll drive oursleves nuts if we become clock watchers. I can get in a big funk if I just look at the "properties" of a file on my computer and see "created" or "last modified." Was it that long ago? Now I just copy it into something new. lol
I dunno where Hellie is. She's probably off molesting Capt'n Jack after she tripped over him in the stairwell.
*g*
Or on the street. I keep telling her to trip over a hot fellow so she could grope him.
That tripping thing might have worked for me not long ago. I totally missed the East Coast Surfing Championships that were literally MINUTES from my house. Gah!
I need a drink.
I try not to look at dates on my writing. Otherwise, I just get depressed. I long for the days when I wrote 25k in a week. I was so naive then. I miss those days of writing. I just need to find my way back to those.
Sin - Ignorance is Bliss was never so true as it applies to writing. LOL!
I really do know I had to spend the last two years learning HOW to write. There's no other job in the world where we'd expect ourselves to jump right in with no training or studying. You can't decide to be a nurse and then go to work at a hospital tomorrow. You can't decide to be a lawyer and take a case before a judge this afternoon. Hell, you can't even work the fryers at Micky D's without at least 10 minutes worth of training.
So, I was in training. :)
I like your explanation. We're writers in training. And we're nothing if not determined to get our into our job and do our best.
I think we'll always be in training. What is that saying? The older you get the more you realize what you don't know?
I'm actually going back to college after, ah hem, twenty years or so. But the odd thing is, I'm not picking back up my old journalism major. Even though I knew when I was 18 that I wanted to write, but I know from life that I don't want to BE a journalist. Writing is too much work for too little pay. lol
In my um, mid life crisis? lol, someone asked me, well, what do you want to do? And I threw out, "I don't know, dig for dinosaurs." I was kidding, but only sort of. Why not? lol Okay, a lot of "why nots." (Those digs are usually someplace too hot, I'd be the oldest student there, and yea, what do I do with my seven-year-old? Oh, but he'd be a teen and I'd be an ancient diosaur by the time I finished school! Anyway, I talked myself out of it.) But I meant something that would hold my interest and passion (it does sound like a mid life crisis, huh?). A writer is interested in EVERYTHING, and all this studying for characters' roles made me a little jealous. :)
Oh, btw, I'm not abandoning wanting to be a romance writer. :) But there isn't a "becoming a romance writer" major and I didn't think telling my college advisor I'm on a "learn everything binge" for character roles would be a good thing. :)
I would love to go back to school just to study everything for more input knowledge for writing. I'd love to take a creative writing class and some languages and more history. What are you thinking about Melissa?
This is probably where my practicality together with me being the only source of income gets in my way. I went back to school for a business degree. Very general and practical. No digging for dinasaurs or anything remotely that interesting. *sigh*
It's okay. My practicality won't allow me to quit my job and go back to school. No matter now much I want a CIS degree. If I do it, I'd feel too much like I was sacrificing for me instead of everyone else. That's not cool with my conscience.
Don't be silly, you don't have to quit your job to go back to school. Surely you people don't think I did that. LOL! I WISH I was independently wealthy and could have done that.
Took a break to play in the sandbox. lol Probably as close as I'll get to digging for dinosaurs!
Well, Sin, it's funny how colleges want that - - some career goal. lol Even a liberal ed major has to declare what they plan to do with it. :) I'm actually choosing a geography major, with an empahsis on geographic information systems (GIS) -- learning cartography and analyzing aerial photos. Okay, that may be boring as heck to someone, and maybe I'll think so too, but I'll see how it goes. This field is way left field of what anyone would think I'd choose.
I'll still want to take other classes that I think help with my writing; like you, history, creative writing, languages. The list goes on, and I think psycology really helps a writer, of course. :)
I'm not starting until the spring semester, which actually begins January. It's just "the right time" somehow to go back to college. I've heard it said that people who lost their job in this economy found it a blessing in disguise. And that's been another motto of mine lately! To take the time to regroup and go a different direction is not easy for any of us, but it's possible.
Sin says, I’d feel too much like I was sacrificing for me instead of everyone else. That’s not cool with my conscience.
If you make yourself happy, then others around you will be happy. How pollyanna is that? lol Really, it's hard to put yourself first, but it's not selfish. :) If I wasn't finally accepting I could go to school on grants though, I wouldn't/couldn't go. Yay, for hitting rock bottom. (yeah, heavy sarcasm, sorry!)
Sorry to have gone so far off topic. :( Umm, I'm sure there's a psycology class to take that will help me understand the topic of vice much better and how to redeem a character!
We left the topic long ago. LOL!
Sin - By going back to school, you increase your earning potential. That benefits you and Matty and and little Sins or Mattys that come along. How in the world is that selfish?!
Melissa - I used loans. :( I'll be paying until I die.
I don't know if I'm as into vices as character flaws. For instance, I would see drinking as a vice and arrogance as a character flaw. I'm all over character flaws. And I think character flaws lead to vices - kind of similar to what Janga said earlier about failing to love properly. I have not idea what point I'm trying to make except that maybe it's all good fodder for really interesting intense storytelling.
I also think it's extremely interesting to address behaviors that were thought to be vices, historically speaking, but maybe aren't as scandalous in today's world. I can probably bet that enjoying sex in and of itself for any woman would have probably been considered a vice or extremely unhealthy for said woman.
Good point, Irish. My characters definitely have flaws.
According to the Merriam-Webster dictionary, a vice can be moral depravity or corruption or it can be a habitual and usually trivial defect or shortcoming. So it can go either way.
Actually, that's a pretty wide range of definitions there. Huh.
Extremely unhealthy and I imagine that back in the day, if a woman even uttered aloud that she liked sex, she was probably shunned. Whereas now, if it's good, I'm liable to climb on the nearest rooftop and shout it out. LOL
ITA Ter. That's a pretty wide interpretation of vice. That can be taken several different ways and into several different characteristics.
Irish, what a great point about what's acceptable behavior today being thought of as a vice in history.
Or even vice versa. Like, when people in history medicated themselves with tonics that were patented as cure alls and contained high amounts of alcohol or drugs that weren't regulated as they are today. People became addicted by what they weren't aware was dangerous. I could see that being a vice that would be interesting to explore for a character.
Geez, I'm late taday! I love Janga...that is so true! All vice stems from tryin' ta fill that hole inside. A hole that generally be all 'bout not lovin' enough.
And no, not that hole. Shut up, Sin.
And college! Sigh. I loved all a' them I went to. In CA, we 'ava lot a' junior colleges. I paddled about in one after another, till one day I found all I needed were a math class ta have an AA degree in Language and Literature. So I took the math class. And I were often the oldest person in me classes...
Always take classes when ya can, Sin. Look fer evenin' classes and you'll find somethin' you'll like.
Ter - Yer characters 'ave vices. It be a matter of size!
Is it a vice to always obey the rules? ;)
Q - Luvs ya, too! Glad ta see yer payin' attention.
Now, what do ya mean almost respectable? I'm a witch and I'm terribly respectable.
Since we are slightly off topic...we're talking Stolen Moments and Short Affairs at Cheeky Reads today...that would be novellas and short stories!
Stop by and tell us your fav short story and get a free read or two from author Heather Long.
Now back to the vices...the only one I see on a regular basis is drinking. I like when the hero has gotten past it and he is unlike other men and won't drink.
And what be yer vices Scapegoat? ;)
Oh - and I have a compeltely unhealthy, depraved addicted to frosting! Buttercream frosting...drool!
LOL - my vices or my character's?
Mine...coffee is used and abused by yours truly.
My characters...I don't know them well enough yet!
Not sure that I can agree that "all vices stem from a failure to love properly (God, others and/or self)"
Moderation in all things is the general rule for healthy living.
Sabrina,normal social drinking is perfectly acceptable. Enjoying a fine wine or a vintage malt is one of the most exquisite pleasures.
I would only consider drinking to excess to be a vice and that stems initially from human weakness and greed and later can develop into addiction.
Almost anything can be harmful when taken to excess and that includes food, drink and behaviour (including sex). I don't really see a connection with 'love', even 'failure to love oneself'.
When I was married the words 'Love honour and obey' were used in the marriage ceremony. In Victorian times the 'obey' bit was probably enforced which might be considered a vice nowadays. Anyway Mrs Q totally ignored it I'm glad to say. Equality is much more fun!
Glad to see your back and blowing bubbles Chance. *grin*
Terrio? Ain't frosting one a' yer passions?
Now, Sabrina, don't know yer characters well 'nuff!? Well, what vices ya likely ta give 'em?
And if yer abusin' the coffee...wait. How do ya do that? Ya beat it up? Ya bruisin' the beans?
Ooooo! New drink! The Bruised Bean!
A heady mix of rum and thoroughly thrashed espresso beans. Wit' whipped cream, a' course.
Moderation be the key ta all happiness, Q. But vices don't speak ta moderation, they speak ta overindulgence ta the point a' self-destruction. And self-destruction stems from self-hate. Or, a lack a' love.
Love bein' the factor in faith. That love can be toward a greater bein' if that be yer doctrine. If'n ya love and honor a greater force and believe ya were created by love, than the love ya hold fer the creator means ya love yerself. How else do ya honor that love?
If'n ya wants ta love another...ya must love yerself first or yer love shows a lack of belief. If not in the creative forces a' the universe, than in yerself. So, ya look toward over- indulgence ta fill the void love would normally fill. That's when it becomes a vice.
I believe in Shakespear's words,
"This above all: to thine own self be true,
And it must follow, as the night the day,
Thou canst not then be false to any man."
Bubbles.
"What about your own vices?"
The truth about me is http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ElY5Gr845Fw
However...
I'm very charming. I can be quite disarming. And I'm rather sweet looking. Its a dangerous combination because People usually under estimate me. So it is easy to get them to dance to 'my tune'. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6gScBzmKXTE&feature=fvw
My vice is .... I love trempting dangerous, interesting people out of their shells where they hide away.
Dangerous... Interesting peo[le... Like YOU!
Sorry, crew, I was having my tail tweaked at the local Big O--and have only just gotten freed, once I sprung my car from their jail. (Though I do find it amusing that the Big O is located next to the local strip club. Coincidence? No. Clearly that's a marketing ploy of location, location, location.)
Q, I'm highly flattered you love to tweak my tail. Though you aren't the first to say so. A guy in high school I adored used to "tweak my tail" for the same express purpose--and he would also come to art class (5th hour when he had study hall) to watch me and the others paint, et al. But mostly he said he came to watch me because I threw the best temper tantrums and was so fun to watch. I threw my paint brush at him of course, but let him stay.
I love a character who lies.
Lucy lies a lot in this book. Well, he doesn't lie, per se, he just tells the truth as he knows it...Mr. Master Manipulator. He's seriously the most fun to write because he's so wicked, but wickedly funny.
As for vices, he's trying to acquire as many as possible, so the research on my part to make his scenes as real as possible have been exhausting... *grins*
Is being stubborn a vice? Celi is very stubborn. One of those “my mind is made up and you’re not going to change it” things. Bryan is a bit OCD in that he needs organization and control over his environment.
Pride is the ultimate vice. I think Celi has too much pride to put herself in a predictament where she may be hurt again. Thinking you have control of the universe is also a pride thing. Too much of it--and not enough being humble--oh, yeah, it's a vice. Pride can make you very unlovable. *LOL*
I add my voice to Julie...I want to read this!
I think my favorite part was about the older people who found each other after 60 years. Even if it’s fictional, it warms my heart to think that would be possible. I would love to read a book just about WWII era couples that were torn apart and then find each other many moons down the road. That would be epic.
I would love this kind of story. (Jill Barnett did one called Sentimental Journey...it was really good.)
I like that, he tells the truth as he knows it... That about explains me Caribbean lead. He lies but doesn't consider it a vice. It be a virtue fer a pirate ta lie well. And he lies very well!
Yer right, it be fun ta write.
Hellion!
FINISH! Finish that story So I can read IT.
You're as bad as Lucy...
Jules, I've been writing quite a bit this last month. (You'll have to include August here, since clearly it's Sept 2nd.)
And of course, I'm as bad as Lucy. Lucy is me, but with a penis. I already knew that.
The Captain said "Lucy is me".
That;s why He is sooooo charming ... and maddening ...
Glad to hear about the Good Writing Mode. Or should that be Good Writing Mood?
This sounds too good. I'll have to get this book. Thanks :)
SIN is goin' to band camp.
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