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Sunday, November 13, 2011
Picking a Fight
I was playing on Facebook when I clicked on the funniest quote by Stephen King: “Harry Potter is about confronting fears, finding inner strength and doing what is right in the face of adversity. Twilight is about how important it is to have a boyfriend.”
It’s funny not because it’s right (though I think it is), but because 1.) Good Old Steve didn’t say this* (he just said Meyers wasn’t a very good writer, especially compared to Rowling—which can be forgiven if you consider Mark Twain said Jane Austen couldn’t write and shouldn’t have); 2.) Readers got really pissed off about it. How dare Steve say this? Just exactly how deep was his work anyway.
I have no idea, of course; I don’t read his stuff. (I read very little horror fiction.) But I would believe that Steve finds theme extremely important in fiction. It was one of the first principal things I remember learning about writing in school. We had to decide on a theme we wanted to write about, and then we crafted our story accordingly. It’s not important to just want to write; what matters more is do you have something to say?
It’s around this area of this sort of discussion that sides begin to form and we get the “I read exclusively for escapism and not for theme” and the “stories only about the relationship but no real story are dumb” camps. I, of course, agree with both. I do read for escapism; I do want to read something that takes me away from the daily tedious grind and concentrate on something else entirely. And I don’t start off reading the book, looking for the point of this story—I’m just reading because the characters are interesting. Yes, the kind of books that are all about the relationship, but have no character growth beyond bagging Mr. or Mrs. Right are forgettable. I’m still happy for them; I wondered if it was going to work out; but I didn’t learn anything from them. I still expect my brain candy to have some nutrients in it. If I wanted to escape into something with no point, I’d watch TV. It’s just as relaxing.
Of course, I think focusing on theme can sometimes get complicated because if you’re focused so much on having a great theme, you end up never writing because your theme isn’t great enough. And that’s no good. I think the theme derives from the character’s arc, the GMC. Theme is one of those aspects you refine and discover as you’re writing. What does your character really want? What does your character most fear? Theme tends to be more universal because our wants and fears tend to be more universal.
Let’s circle back to Meyers. I wouldn’t say she’s completely without theme. Her writing is definitely not on par with Rowling, but she is a compelling read, in my opinion. Her ability to draw me completely into the world of the whineiest teenage girl I’ve ever read and make me care about the story’s outcome was a true feat. Kudos to her.
I believe if you asked Meyers what the theme was for her books, she’d have an answer. I’m sure if you found enough readers, they’d give you an answer what the themes were in the series. Like, “You don’t get to pick who you fall in love with” and “Love is about accepting all parts of a person, even the dark parts.” There’s probably some themes about family, what constitutes a family, and can men and women be friends. Maybe the biggest: love has no age boundaries. Edward is 100+ and Bella is 17. Then there is imprinting—that’s definitely a thematic bomb in what constitutes love and how young is too young.
So I think we could agree the themes were there. The question may be: how well were the themes executed? There’s the whole “action is louder than words” problem. If your character says or thinks one way, but acts in the opposite manner—you run the chance of losing your audience. It’s a sign of a weak character to me. (Characters who say or think one way in the beginning of a book and then act the opposite at the end of a story is different—that’s a character arc. I mean, doing it within the same paragraph.) I think Bella came off as a weaker character because she cared far more about keeping Edward than she cared about having any sense of self. And she was the heroine. It was like she gave away her rights completely. Love is about finding the balance in the chaos.
I believe in the beginning, I have a theme in mind (however grainy it may be at first) that is the undercurrent to the characters. How can my characters show this theme? Can I make it ironic or poignant or funny? And as time goes on, I get a better grip on my theme and my characters. Theme is another of the things to go back over when you’re done to make sure you’ve kept to it throughout; that you haven’t run contradictory to the promise you made to your readers in the beginning.
Do you notice theme in the stories you read? Are there certain themes you look for in novels that you prefer and tend to remember better than others? Do you write the same theme over and over in my manuscripts, or do they change a little? (I think mine change some. My core story is basically the same, but the themes differ a bit from book to book.) Did you read Twilight? What themes did you find? The movie is out Friday--are you going to see it?
*So who did say this quotation? According to my googling sources, it says Andrew Futral did. Either way, I still think it’s hysterical.
It’s funny not because it’s right (though I think it is), but because 1.) Good Old Steve didn’t say this* (he just said Meyers wasn’t a very good writer, especially compared to Rowling—which can be forgiven if you consider Mark Twain said Jane Austen couldn’t write and shouldn’t have); 2.) Readers got really pissed off about it. How dare Steve say this? Just exactly how deep was his work anyway.
I have no idea, of course; I don’t read his stuff. (I read very little horror fiction.) But I would believe that Steve finds theme extremely important in fiction. It was one of the first principal things I remember learning about writing in school. We had to decide on a theme we wanted to write about, and then we crafted our story accordingly. It’s not important to just want to write; what matters more is do you have something to say?
It’s around this area of this sort of discussion that sides begin to form and we get the “I read exclusively for escapism and not for theme” and the “stories only about the relationship but no real story are dumb” camps. I, of course, agree with both. I do read for escapism; I do want to read something that takes me away from the daily tedious grind and concentrate on something else entirely. And I don’t start off reading the book, looking for the point of this story—I’m just reading because the characters are interesting. Yes, the kind of books that are all about the relationship, but have no character growth beyond bagging Mr. or Mrs. Right are forgettable. I’m still happy for them; I wondered if it was going to work out; but I didn’t learn anything from them. I still expect my brain candy to have some nutrients in it. If I wanted to escape into something with no point, I’d watch TV. It’s just as relaxing.
Of course, I think focusing on theme can sometimes get complicated because if you’re focused so much on having a great theme, you end up never writing because your theme isn’t great enough. And that’s no good. I think the theme derives from the character’s arc, the GMC. Theme is one of those aspects you refine and discover as you’re writing. What does your character really want? What does your character most fear? Theme tends to be more universal because our wants and fears tend to be more universal.
Let’s circle back to Meyers. I wouldn’t say she’s completely without theme. Her writing is definitely not on par with Rowling, but she is a compelling read, in my opinion. Her ability to draw me completely into the world of the whineiest teenage girl I’ve ever read and make me care about the story’s outcome was a true feat. Kudos to her.
I believe if you asked Meyers what the theme was for her books, she’d have an answer. I’m sure if you found enough readers, they’d give you an answer what the themes were in the series. Like, “You don’t get to pick who you fall in love with” and “Love is about accepting all parts of a person, even the dark parts.” There’s probably some themes about family, what constitutes a family, and can men and women be friends. Maybe the biggest: love has no age boundaries. Edward is 100+ and Bella is 17. Then there is imprinting—that’s definitely a thematic bomb in what constitutes love and how young is too young.
So I think we could agree the themes were there. The question may be: how well were the themes executed? There’s the whole “action is louder than words” problem. If your character says or thinks one way, but acts in the opposite manner—you run the chance of losing your audience. It’s a sign of a weak character to me. (Characters who say or think one way in the beginning of a book and then act the opposite at the end of a story is different—that’s a character arc. I mean, doing it within the same paragraph.) I think Bella came off as a weaker character because she cared far more about keeping Edward than she cared about having any sense of self. And she was the heroine. It was like she gave away her rights completely. Love is about finding the balance in the chaos.
I believe in the beginning, I have a theme in mind (however grainy it may be at first) that is the undercurrent to the characters. How can my characters show this theme? Can I make it ironic or poignant or funny? And as time goes on, I get a better grip on my theme and my characters. Theme is another of the things to go back over when you’re done to make sure you’ve kept to it throughout; that you haven’t run contradictory to the promise you made to your readers in the beginning.
Do you notice theme in the stories you read? Are there certain themes you look for in novels that you prefer and tend to remember better than others? Do you write the same theme over and over in my manuscripts, or do they change a little? (I think mine change some. My core story is basically the same, but the themes differ a bit from book to book.) Did you read Twilight? What themes did you find? The movie is out Friday--are you going to see it?
*So who did say this quotation? According to my googling sources, it says Andrew Futral did. Either way, I still think it’s hysterical.
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58 comments:
Wonder why Steve-O ended up credited with the quote... He probably simply agreed with it.
Theme. Well, my themes involved second chances, taking chances, seizing the day, learning to live where you land...insanity is nothing more than a concept?
*faceplant
I never read the Twilight stuff. Or saw the movies. I love the stuff on FB with Buffy against the entire Twilight thing...
As for what I want in a book/theme? Teach me something. Either through the theme/relationship growth, etc...or within the plot....
I don't seem to have a theme in mind when I'm writing my stories. I think they are there, and as you said, they are more apparent as I develop the story. I'm sure it reflects my world view, even if I'm not deliberately trying to show that.
I got sucked into the first 3 Twilight books, but I only managed to endure the first movie. I do find it intriguing that people find so many different aspects to the book, all of which support their reasons for loving or hating the thing. I think that says more about the reader than the writer, though. :)
Gotta dash off to work. Great topic though! Can't wait to see what everyone else has to say too. :)
I love themes and depth in books, but I'm with you that as I write, whatever theme I think I started with is going to be revised and refined by the characters and their growth/arc/motivations, etc. I think for my current WIP, the theme is somewhere around "How much are you willing to sacrifice for someone you love?" And more importantly, what happens if you were wrong? If you sacrificed everything for someone who didn't deserve it. Then what? How far will you go to get back what you lost?
As far as Twilight, I read the books, and while I agree with just about everyone that they're light in terms of depth and theme, and are generally poorly written, they sucked me in. From the first paragraph of the first book, I was hooked. I have no idea why (besides the fact that I was just as whiny and indecisive as
Bella at that age), but I loved the story. And I got hooked on the story. Until she jumped to Jacob's POV at the end of the 3rd book - she lost me right there.
I don't have a theme going in, but I think I have one (or more?) when I'm done. Current MS would be learning to think for yourself. Respecting others' choices. Getting your priorities straight. Oh, and a little of that you can't help who you fall in love with.
I never read the Twilight books and only saw the first two movies. I was out after that. Kiddo is dying to see the new one but she'll be seeing it with someone else because I'm not sitting through it.
Anyone think Meyer was shooting for the good vs. evil thing? Not sure since I didn't read them.
I'm like Ter. I don't have a theme on the way in, but I think I end up with one whether I like it or not. LOL!!
I did read the Twilight books. Even as I hated the underlying messages in the stories, I admit that Meyer's voice sucks me in. I personally hate that Bella is reduced to lying in the fetal position when Edward leaves her. And she sits around for months pining for him. Also, it felt like she gave up everything (her mortality!) to be with him. I just don't know if I like that. Not sure that's the best message for teenage girls. But as I said, I read and enjoyed them.
Now Hermione? There's a good role model for girls, I think.
2nd, I figured Steve-o ended up with the credit because he was a better known entity--AND it was well known he hated Meyers' writing.
Second chances and what you do with them is a great them. I've read many a book with that theme, and I enjoy how the character changes himself AND the people around him with his new chance.
Donna, I think most of my themes become more apparent after several chapters--or more likely, a few false beginnings, as I'm trying to figure out who my characters really are. Who are they? What are they trying to say?
Yes, interpretations of the book do say much more about the reader than the writer. The writer could have meant something else entirely. You have no control over a reader's perceptions or filters, as 2nd said before on the blog.
P.S. I loved Jacob's POV. *LOL* Go TEAM JACOB!
Hal, I find it interesting you circle the same questions in your writing--because they're rather specific. I think I usually circle themes like "REDEMPTION" a lot. Actually, I think one of the questions I circle with all my books is "Is the person you see on the surface really the person they really are?" I'm all about the LOOK CLOSER. Sorta like looking for the nugget of gold beneath all the dirt. *LOL* The Ugly Duckling theme, I guess.
I don't know if I noticed so much the "poorly written" as I noticed the "light in theme" *LOL*, which probably says a lot for my grammar skills right there. I knew she was no Rowling, but I guess I figured if she was compelling enough to suck me in (and she did, I read her fast), her writing wasn't that bad. It was the weakness of the heroine that bothered me. It was like Bella was supposed to be thought of as strong and stubborn, fighting for who she wanted--Edward is always calling her stubborn--but her actions are so weak. The execution didn't work. I don't think you should do that to your character, if you make them the hero AND give them a happy ending. Storytelling doesn't work that way.
It was like Bella was supposed to be thought of as strong and stubborn, fighting for who she wanted–Edward is always calling her stubborn–but her actions are so weak. The execution didn’t work.
I so agree with you there. I didn't notice the writing flaws so much as I was reading (I couldn't put down the first few books, either), but things stuck out to me later. Mostly phrases like, "His eyes were curious. My eyes were mad." Really? Really??
Bo'sun, I definitely see those themes addressed in your story. And I think we're on the page where we're not sure of our themes in our stories until we know our characters better, which usually comes from writing them. I think we're all in the same boat here. *LOL*
You don't know what happens in the 4th book? You're aware there is the bloodiest birthing scene that's ever been written, right? Oh, and that they're on a honeymoon--and when they first filmed it and screened, the rating system wanted to give them an R, so they had to edit. Just a heads up. *LOL*
I think there is some themes of good vs evil within her writing. There is the Voltera (sp?) in Italy who are supposed to be "good" and protect the people by being enforcers of what vampires can and cannot do, but really they're very evil. I'm sure there are other examples--but I'm drawing a blank.
I personally hate that Bella is reduced to lying in the fetal position when Edward leaves her. And she sits around for months pining for him. Also, it felt like she gave up everything (her mortality!) to be with him.
And don't forget to mention the whole creepy stalker aspect Edward has and complete control freak about who she can be friends with and what she can drive.
I agree: Hermione is much better. :)
and yeah, my themes get real specific, lol. But the overarching theme is most certainly redemption, and I think that's true of everything I've ever written. Not sure what that says about me (I don't feel like I need to redeem myself from anything in particular), but themes of redemption and salvation and the like always appeal to me.
*LOL* Those phrases wouldn't have stuck out to me. I think eyes can be curious. *LOL* How sad am I? Ms. Yount is going to come on here and open a can of whoop ass on me, I just know it.
Can a gaze be curious then? Or his expression?
But the overarching theme is most certainly redemption, and I think that’s true of everything I’ve ever written. Not sure what that says about me (I don’t feel like I need to redeem myself from anything in particular), but themes of redemption and salvation and the like always appeal to me.
Definitely for me too, but I figure mine comes from having to sit in church all those years and listen to who will be redeemed and who won't. I'm pretty sure I never agreed with their stance of who be redeemed and who wouldn't. It seemed so narrow, esp when God is so big.
I know the graphic nature of it. I think she can handle it. I've let her watch real birth on television. And told her the birth scene in the movie is supposed to be way nasty. She'll probably cover her eyes.
Now I need to see what I have eyes doing in my GH entry.
Okay, I know I just got here, but I have to renew my license and get my car checked out. I'll check in on you guys later. Have a productive day! Miss you!
ack. I didn't mean to start anything with the eyes. I'm all about seeing a curious gaze or curious eyes on someone else's face. It was the "my eyes were mad" that drove me nuts. In first-person POV, there's so many ways to convey anger, without having to describe her own eyes, which she can't see. *shurg* but that's one of my personal things, not necessarily an indictment on what anyone else's eyes are doing :)
I love using the phrase, "He cut his eyes to her" to describe that turn-of-the-head, out of the corner of your eyes type look. My thesis adviser had a field day with that one. "What, did he literally chop out his eyes and hand them to her?" that always pissed me off. So I say eyes can do whatever they want to do. Even be mad, which totally negates my first rant.
sorry guys - it's been a long day, after a long weekend, and I'm rambling. I'll shut up now ;)
Hellie, have you read Flannery O'Connor's short story "Revelation." If not, please do. I think you'll like O'Connor's view of the redeemed.
Most romances are about redemption on some level. O'Connor believed that story is fundamentally linked to redemption. “There is something in us, as storytellers and as listeners to stories, that demands the redemptive act, that demands that what falls at least be offered the chance to be restored.”
My fiction ends up tied to the theme of finding home and a place to belong, but I leave it to my subconscious to work it into the story. I can imagine the disastrously overwritten crap I'd have if I became self-conscious about it.
You mean you had the nerve to question authority? What, do you think you have free will or are supposed to think for yourself? Weren't you paying attention?!
Sorry, I wasn't good at church either. Which is why I don't go. The older I get the harder it is NOT to yell BULLSHIT every few minutes.
I was kidding about the eyes. And if these things are 1stPOV from Bella, HOW did she suddenly flip to Jacob??? And didn't she try to write the same from Edward's but that rough got leaked and she threw a fit and quit? (Not that I wouldn't have thrown a fit too.)
I forgot to say that I haven't read the Twilight books or seen the movies. It's all I can do to listen to the oldest grand's raves. I am not a fan of vampires. I didn't even like Barnabus Collins when most of my friends were addicted to Dark Shadows.
I love that Flannery O'Connor quote, Janga!
The older I get the harder it is NOT to yell BULLSHIT every few minutes.
I've been talking to some friends about going back to Church now with Carter, as it seems weird not to send a kid to Sunday School, but this was my exact though. I'd just end up sitting there and fuming the whole time and wanting to well Bullshit and run out. Not a good example! haha
And yeah, the first two books are 1st person from Bella, the epilogue of book 3 is first-person from Jacob, and then book 4 switches back and forth between Bella and Jacob (all first-person). I have a personal pet-peeve of having to adjust to different "I" characters, so the change made me throw the book down. I was pissed. haha.
Just to be clear, I'm not knocking faith. Me and the Big Guy are good. It's the twits down here who think they can speak for him that make me nuts.
I've heard talk about multi-POV's first person books. Some on this blog. I realize it falls into the "you can do anything if you do it well enough" category, but I can't imagine reading something like that. My brain would balk, I'm afraid.
Janga - We are always redeeming one character or another. In fact, I was so worried about NOT being able to redeem my characters, I had to take sex almost completely out of the book. (There is a sex scene in the resolution.) Not sure you could tell a story without some kind of redemption thread running through it.
OK, I was just giving out a warning since I didn't think you knew what happened. *LOL*
Yes!! Me too! And of course, I was always on the “unable to be redeemed” side of the equation because I did things like (*gasp*) question the legitimacy of the pastor to decide such a thing. *sigh* I didn’t do well in Church.
And I always thought I was the black sheep of my church. There must be a LOT of black sheep out there, and not just the ones that frequent this ship.
And yes, I really hated my preacher saying on his authority who God would and wouldn't take. *LOL*
Hal, I agree with the "my eyes were mad" as bad writing. Because you can't see your eyes in first person--unless she was looking in a mirror and then she's just vain. Or is she saying ONLY her eyes were mad, which seems odd that eyes would be so offended but every other body part is okay with it.
Still...she's connected to a lot of readers, made a lot of money, and wrote from her heart instead of to trends--so she's got to get some kudos for that.
There are lots of things in church that make me want to call bullshit. *LOL*
Bo'sun, as Hal said, it's first person Bella for much of the book, then it's first person Jacob; and then it does first half Bella in book four and last half in Jacob in book four, then I think it goes back to Bella. That part didn't bother me, but I can handle more than one first person going. It's like 3rd person for me, but more restricted. No head hopping.
Allie Condie's newest book, CROSSED, does first person and it flips back and forth between Ky and Cassia. Each chapter is marked with the character's name we're in the head of. It worked for me, but I think you have to enjoy first person anyway. If you don't enjoy first person, it may be non-negotiable thing.
So are there themes anyone avoids in their reading? Or anyone find a theme in their work they didn't intend to have in there?
Janga, I haven't read that yet, but now I'll have to look it up. I do agree with that quotation, that what falls should be offered a chance at redemption.
I love stories that deal with coming home, finding home, realizing you always had a home, et al. BELONGING is a key theme as big as redemption, I think. I think they almost go hand in hand.
Bo'sun, you did have to run a tricky tightrope with your story. But now you've proven you don't have to have sex every 30 pages to have a great romance.
Goodness, I hope so.
And I meant to mention this earlier. Some of you said you like to learn something from your books. Oddly, I don't think I have this desire. Not when it comes to themes. I love Nora's books because I learn about glass blowing, boat building, scuba diving, or horse racing. Those things I find interesting. But I don't want to be taught a life lesson in my books.
The characters should learn some lessons, and I enjoy reading how that happens, but the author actually setting out to teach me something skirts a line for me.
Good questions, Bo'sun.
I think the only themes I tend to avoid are death ones. (Except for Harry Potter's death themes, which are the exception to the rule.) If I can figure out someone had a dreaded disease on the back blurb, I don't want to read about it. I don't want to read about LOSS and FINDING PEACE AFTER LOSS because I do that enough now. I don't need fictitious versions of it.
And I try to avoid rich people. I'm successful of this in real life, but in fiction, they seem to be everywhere. It's like you're not happy if you're not filthy rich.
As for themes I don't mean to have--I think I have BETRAYAL themes I don't mean to do. I don't think you can avoid them because betrayal is always a part of a story, it seems. How else would you be offered redemption if betrayal didn't play a part somewhere? But I don't care much for betrayal; I'm not comfortable writing about it because I don't think it's a very forgivable act. If ever.
Well, let's be clear. I don't want to read an author that sounds PREACHY with life lessons--but if I'm aware of a life lesson within myself that needs to be learned and I'm reading about characters who learn the same lesson and how they deal with it--sometimes that sheds some light for me. Harry Potter and death--we all know I'm not cool with death, but the lessons Harry learns reassure me. They make me feel better about death. I'm sure that sounds nuts, but it is why I love the books so much.
I do like learning stuff like you said (and I think 2nd said)--which is stuff characters do: glass blowing or weaving or quilting, et al.
"I’ve been talking to some friends about going back to Church now with Carter, as it seems weird not to send a kid to Sunday School, but this was my exact though. I’d just end up sitting there and fuming the whole time and wanting to well Bullshit and run out. Not a good example! haha"
I'm an atheist. So I'm not one for encouraging religion. I also work for a church. My take on the above is that you haven't found the right church. The place I work, for example, is part of a progressive branch of Christianity, and while my unbelieving self finds it all very silly, the messages that are preached focus on love, forgiveness and caring for others. None of the bigotry, sexism, etc. of some denominations. Just sayin'.
As for theme, I don't usually start out with a clear sense of theme in my own writing. Theme is something I find along the way or in revision. I find my themes are often wrapped around the realization that your flaws are your strengths.
I read the first Twilight novel. Meyer's voice is engaging, even though nothing happens for the first two-thirds except for Edward following Bella around and grumbling that she is following him around. *Face palm.* Overall, Bella is an extremely weak character and the "love conquers all" kind of bullshit waaay too twee for me. (And I read loads of YA.)
Thematically, I found Harry Potter much more powerful. And The Hunger Games just blew me away.
Completely OT: I want these.
http://www.amazon.com/Imak-Products-Computer-ergoBeads-20128/dp/B000FEVWU8/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1321294442&sr=8-1
That is all.
If Dystopian is a theme then that's the one I avoid. Though that's not really a theme. What is the theme in Dystopian then? Survival? Overcoming incredible odds? The power of the human spirit? None of these appeal to me.
I'm either extremely shallow or prefer my Pollyanna shades. Probably both.
I think Dystopian is more a sub-genre defined by setting/situation than a theme. But again, we're getting in language nuances here. :)
Hunger Games, which is dystopian, really resonated with me, because beyond being an exploration of how people respond to awful circumstances, love, etc., it also looked at how power corrupts, even those with good intentions, and how easily a populace can be swayed by and distracted by their government, to the extent of ignoring the suffering of others.
But, yeah, I often like my fiction pitch black.
See, my inner Pollyanna wouldn't make it far into that one. I know everyone raves about them. (And I hear the movie trailer is amazing.) But I have no interest.
I avoid anything with suffering, I think. Which thankfully doesn't happen much in the Romances I read. Even humiliation of a character is hard for me to read.
Hunger Games is grueling. Technically, some of the darkest stuff I've read in a while. If that's not your thing, I wouldn't recommend it.
I haven't read Twilight. It's about vampires isn't it? Yuck .... Not for me.
I hate the idea of drinking blood!
Despite my dislike of vampires I'm OK with Demons and spilling of blood in battle.
I have just read Terry Brooks's 'Elf Stones of Shanara'. It's a gripping tale with a unique romantic theme though not a romance.
The hero and heroine struggle against demon forces to find and immerse the seed of the dying Elchrist tree in the 'Blood Fire'. The two fall in love in the process but at the end the heroine goes to the dead Elchrist and gives herself to the spirit of the tree and so becomes the tree's rebirth. In doing this she saves the world from Demon invasion but breaks the heart of the hero. Have you ever met a heroine who turns into a plant? It may sound funny but a had a box of tissues handy. LOL.
My favourite theme would be the underdog coming out tops, especially if its the heroine.
Fascinating topic and discussion :)
" ...which can be forgiven if you consider Mark Twain said Jane Austen couldn’t write and shouldn’t have"
Well. I'm in good company then aren't I? Since couldn’t write and shouldn’t have written are definitely good words to my describe my scribblings. And yes I suppose that I do embrace themes that are a “variation on” life is a life lesson. So often life , death (not necessarily of the physical body, but of dreams, relationships, hope , etc etc … ) , paradoxes, and resolutions are themes commonly found in my meandering thoughts.
My favorite themes in literature are Redemption and Emotional growth.
Just saw a t-shirt for Hellie.
SAVE A WOLF
(ride a Cullen)
I’m an atheist. I also work for a church.
This is the funniest thing I've read today.
P.Kirby, Hunger Games is probably the best known dystopian themed series that I haven't read. I get into the dystopian themed books--I really get into the societies where power corrupts and the people who rise out of it and rebel against it. It's like a futuristic American Revolution. I'm all about the rebels.
But I can't get into Hunger Games because it involves children killing each other as a punishment implemented by the Society--and the PARENTS allow it. There is just so much of this that screams against it. I would have thought the parents would have rose against it, no matter what, but they'd rather save the kids they can and sacrifice the others. It's so medieval. In a sense, I know that's how it used to be, if you consider how much a child could die in childhood, so you were basically saving the ones you can--but that's not the case now. You can save them now. You don't have children fight your battles. But I know the author said something about this was something done back in Greece or Rome??? Is that right?
My favorite dystopian books: Divergent series, Matched series, Delirium series...
Bo'sun, I find it amusing you love angst and pain in your romance, but not for your setting. I consider dystopian setting as another character. Instead of the flaw/hurdle for the characters to overcome, they have to overcome the setting (instead of a Mother Nature natural disaster, a man-made Society one).
But of course, dystopian settings appeal to my Commie nature. *LOL*
Should definitely get the gloves. Protecting your wrists now is much more cost-efficient than paying for the surgery later.
Hi Quantum, thanks for braving the Twi-hards to bring sense to the blog. :)
The two fall in love in the process but at the end the heroine goes to the dead Elchrist and gives herself to the spirit of the tree and so becomes the tree’s rebirth. In doing this she saves the world from Demon invasion but breaks the heart of the hero.
This reminds me of a scene in Conan the Barbarian. (Deerhunter raves about it. Something about the woman sacrifices herself for Conan on the Tree of Woe.) This theme seems to be common in the Hero's Journey (not turning women into plants, per se)--killing off the woman. *LOL* I think it's like Keats' Ode on a Grecian Urn. It's the Hero's Journey way of making sure the love never fades. If the couple ended up together, they'd fight about the remote control, but if she sacrifices herself to save his life, well, then he'll love her forever. *LOL*
Bo'sun: I sooooo need that t-shirt. If only to annoy Deerhunter. Where'd you find it? *LOL*
Demi, you're always in good company, aren't you? You're with us!
I don't think you covered ALL THE TOPICS you've given us your life's wisdom about....keep going.
Someone put the pic on Twitter, of course. Couldn't find a link directly to a site where you could buy it though.
I think this is the stuff that freaks me out about writing. Someone says what is your theme and I go "Oh, crap I don't have one of those. I can't write!" In reality, I'm sure I probably have a theme but like many others I don't know it until I'm into the story a bit.
Never read Twilight or saw any of the movies. My daughter read the first one and didn't want to continue - has no interest in the movies either. On the other hand, entering our house lately and NOT finding a Harry Potter movie playing is probably harder than winning the Lotto at this point. I can pretty much quote this thing in my sleep! I had them both begging me Friday to go to the video store to get The Deathly Hallows Part 2 at 10 am while they were in school. I'm looking into getting the whole 8 movie set for her for Xmas which pretty much guarantees I'll be watching them until she goes off to college! LOL
Hal, pick whatever church you are comfortable with (the one you know all the rules to) and then just temper what he learns. I felt the same way, but wanted my kids to have a base so I kind of gave them Catholic light - I put my two cents in whenever I could and made it a little less dogmatic! I tell them all the time it is way more important to be a good human being than a good "insert religion here" (Catholic, Luthern, etc).
We did a Deathly Hallows marathon Saturday night, Irish. Part 1 was on HBO then we rolled into Part 2 OnDemand. Was really cool to see them back to back like that. But we should have thrown movie 6 in the mix first. Totally forgot I had that!
They've been running the whole series on one of the cable chanels for the past week. So as soon as one of them walks in the door the TV goes on, goes to that chanel and stays there until we go to bed. We all wander in and out and catch different parts of different shows. It's hilarious. We can tell in one scene which episode it is, or at least they can. LOL
We did the marathon Friday night :)
You need the other five movies. *LOL* Not just the exciting ones. *LOL*
Don't freak out, Irish. *LOL* I think we've all reached a consensus none of us start out with a theme, but eventually we find have one, whether we want it or not. It's like a story within a story. I think we almost always write about more than a character and the story of that character. Writers, I believe, write to solve their own mysteries by using...allegories, parables maybe. We figure out who we are through our writing.
Though me saying that really freaks me out for Stephen King. *LOL*
I'm sure Dad wishes I could fail to find Harry Potter on cable. *LOL* Poor man. He can't stand those movies. We were watching ONCE UPON A TIME the other day and he said, "Is this those Harry movies again?"
Shame that being a good human being and a good "insert religion here" doesn't coincide more. :)
ABCFamily!
Yes, they're running on a loop on ABC Family. In fact, I finally caught part of the first one I'd never seen. When Harry gets his wand. Or when it chooses him, I should say. All this time and I'd never seen that part. When he sees all that gold in his vault is pretty funny too. I should really sit through that first one. At least the beginning of it.
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