Wednesday, August 11, 2010
When the character is a writer too...
I re-read a book this week I've read several times before--Envy, by Sandra Brown. She's a particularly favorite author of mine, so re-reading one of her books wasn't a surprise. It's often listed as her best, so again, no surprise.
What is a surprise is this is a book in which the author took a oft-used plot device--one that I usually abhor--and turned into a book I not only loved, but devoured for the upteenth time.
It's the character-as-writer thing. Anybody else bothered by this, or is it just me? You know the book about the quiet, shy, romance writer who has a boring sex life and so then decides to have a one-night stand with the hottie neighbor to expand her repertoire? Or the book about the publishing executive or agent who has a high powered career despite the baby she gave up for adoption way back when.
For some reason, the peek into the publishing world inside my fiction drives me batty. Perhaps because my real life is filled with the publishing biz, I don't want it invading my fiction. But I think it's more than that. It's hard for me to get invested in a character who is a writer, because it reminds me that I'm reading the results of...well...a writer. I can't forget I'm reading a book. I can't dive into the story, into the setting, into a new world.
Or maybe characters who are also writers feel so close to Mary-Sue characters that I just get too twitchy to keep reading.
But in this particular book, the heroine is a high-powered editor. Her husband and father are editors, running a NY Publishing house. The hero is a writer. Not only is the hero a writer, but whole sections of his current work-in-progress are within the book. It's novel-within-a-novel structure.
Any one of these things would normally make me shudder. Maybe I could be talked into reading it once and grudgingly admitting to enjoying it. But to read, and read, and re-read, and dwell on, and think about....to be utterly engrossed by a plot device I hate, is rare.
The structure and the concept are cliche, not doubt about it. A novel being written by the struggling-writer-character actually inserted into the narrative. Yikes. But the emotion, the depth, the characters, the heart...all of it make this a book I can't forget instead of just a cliche.
In a recent RWR article, Christina Dodd mentioned suggested we not think of them as cliches, but as myths. All cultures have them, stories that speak to the human emotional experience, stories which have remained virtually the same for millennia. Embrace the cliche, she says, after all, they're stories we've loved forever. Just give it heart.
So what do you think? What cliche, or myth, do you hate most? Ever been blown away by how it was handled? Do you agree that cliches are simply passed-down myths, a starting point, rather than something to avoid? What cliches do you absolutely love to read over and over?
What is a surprise is this is a book in which the author took a oft-used plot device--one that I usually abhor--and turned into a book I not only loved, but devoured for the upteenth time.
It's the character-as-writer thing. Anybody else bothered by this, or is it just me? You know the book about the quiet, shy, romance writer who has a boring sex life and so then decides to have a one-night stand with the hottie neighbor to expand her repertoire? Or the book about the publishing executive or agent who has a high powered career despite the baby she gave up for adoption way back when.
For some reason, the peek into the publishing world inside my fiction drives me batty. Perhaps because my real life is filled with the publishing biz, I don't want it invading my fiction. But I think it's more than that. It's hard for me to get invested in a character who is a writer, because it reminds me that I'm reading the results of...well...a writer. I can't forget I'm reading a book. I can't dive into the story, into the setting, into a new world.
Or maybe characters who are also writers feel so close to Mary-Sue characters that I just get too twitchy to keep reading.
But in this particular book, the heroine is a high-powered editor. Her husband and father are editors, running a NY Publishing house. The hero is a writer. Not only is the hero a writer, but whole sections of his current work-in-progress are within the book. It's novel-within-a-novel structure.
Any one of these things would normally make me shudder. Maybe I could be talked into reading it once and grudgingly admitting to enjoying it. But to read, and read, and re-read, and dwell on, and think about....to be utterly engrossed by a plot device I hate, is rare.
The structure and the concept are cliche, not doubt about it. A novel being written by the struggling-writer-character actually inserted into the narrative. Yikes. But the emotion, the depth, the characters, the heart...all of it make this a book I can't forget instead of just a cliche.
In a recent RWR article, Christina Dodd mentioned suggested we not think of them as cliches, but as myths. All cultures have them, stories that speak to the human emotional experience, stories which have remained virtually the same for millennia. Embrace the cliche, she says, after all, they're stories we've loved forever. Just give it heart.
So what do you think? What cliche, or myth, do you hate most? Ever been blown away by how it was handled? Do you agree that cliches are simply passed-down myths, a starting point, rather than something to avoid? What cliches do you absolutely love to read over and over?
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81 comments:
Geez, Hal! You ask hard questions! What cliche/myth do I hate to read? The high powered woman who longs to give it all up for a simpler life. I'm sorry, I just don't know buy it. Have I ever seen it done so well I forget how much I hate it? Nope. Don't mean it hasn't happened, I just haven't read it.
I can agree that a myth is a starting point and it can be done with panache...if twisted sufficently. Lord knows I twist the cliche/myth of pirates constantly!
I love the spunky heroine, stumbling into trouble and rising above it. Granted, it can be overdone, ala JE...but, for the most part, I do love spunky heroines...
And I love reading twisted history. Just love it!
Honestly, you're the professor/student and you know the actual terminology, all I know are plot ideas!
Ah, watching "The Hallelujah Trail" on late night TV...now there's a cliche/myth I can get behind!
My reaction is the opposite of yours, Hal. I love writer heroines--and heroes. Going all the way back to childhood when my favorite heroines were Jo March, Anne Shirley, and Betsy Ray, writers all, I've had an affection for such characters. I can think of many favorite romances that feature writer protagonists--Heyer's Sylvester, Ivory's Black Silk, Kleypas's Dreaming of You, Ruth Wind's In the Midnight Rain, Nora Roberts's Jewels of the Sun . . .
In Laura Lee Guhrke's With Seduction in Mind, which I loved, both the heroine and hero are writers. And in one of my all-time favorite category romances, Kathleen Korbel's A Rose for Maggie, the hero is a children's book writer, and the heroine is his editor. One of the things I liked best about Julia Quinn's latest is that the hero's great secret is his authorship of romances.
Now love triangles, OTOH, I loathe. But I thought Jennifer Haymore's A Hint of Wicked was a powerful, courageous book, and I loved Julia London's Summer of Two Wishes. I'm also totally hooked on C. S. Harris's Sebastian St. Cyr mysteries.
Chance -- yay for twisting pirate cliches! I agree that if twisted properly, any cliche can become awesome. And they are just all plot ideas (I wasn't trying to sound like a professor...lol! I wrote this late last night with my eyes barely open. How funny!)
I also enjoy the spunky heroine, although recently I've noticed a very fine line between spunky and snide. A lot of first-person narratives of spunky heroines seem to cross that line for me, when she starts making snide/snarky comments to the reader.
I'm going to admit I don't know what the Hallelujah Trial is.....and just the name alone is conjuring up some odd ideas...lol
Janga, I love that we have such an opposite reaction! And you're absolutely right that characters like Jo March and Anne Shirley (favorites of mine as well from childhood) are such good examples of when it's done well.
I'm not usually a fan of the love triangle either. I think the fact that one person is going to end up hurting and alone, no matter how happy the ending for the other two, upsets me. I get majorly stressed out with love triangles :)
Thanks for all the good examples -- I haven't read most -- I need to add some of these to my list!
I like writer heroines (and heroes)--one of my favorite movies is Her Alibi that has Tom Selleck in it. He writes murder mysteries...and it's a silly romp, but I love hearing his "writing" as you're watching what's really going on. It's enough to make you scream with laughter, as his hero, which we know is "him", is doing 200 push ups, but Tom the writer trips over a jumprope.
I loved that Xtina Dodd article!! I screamed with laughter (again) the whole time reading. The Squawk ladies' friendships remind me of the friendships on this ship--the way we pick on each other, but clearly support each other too. (Sorry that was off tangent.)
Yes, I think to a degree that cliches are like the myths. I mean, I believe in the myths, definitely, but I don't know if EVERY cliche is myth status. I do agree with Lisa Kleypas in the article who said every cliche has truth in it--which is why everyone has their own favorite cliche, the cliche that speaks to them and connects with them on the human experience level.
For me, that cliche is the awkward, smart, not very pretty heroine who falls in love with the handsome jock/rake. And miracle of miracles, he falls in love with her.
Cliches I won't read? The rich guy--I think I have a problem with the uber-rich guy. The sheik (I have problems with the sheik on other levels too, but money is the common denominator with the rest in this list); the billionaire/millionaire; the CEO; the prince--I hate them all. If the name is in the title, it's discarded. If the back of the book mentions it, it's gone. They're not useful men. (For some reason, Lords don't fall here because they're always 'working' on their estates, so I sort of think of them as gentlemen farmers. Odd, but it's how I justify it.)
Clearly Lisa Kleypas loves rich men, but her rich men still could hang a shelf, fix a flat, or win a barroom brawl. They're useful men, so it cancels out that nasty "rich" problem.
The Hallelujah Trail is a campy western, but HILARIOUS. *LOL* The ending with all the casks of beer (isn't that what it was?) is worth watching it...it's this whole complicated set up. It's funny.
Another "different" but funny western is: Waterhole #9. Which is interesting to say because there is a technical rape scene in the beginning--I mean, seriously, you'd never get away with that sort of story now--but at the end, the girl and guy end up together. Sorta. I think she rides after him at any rate. *shakes head*
So so far, I'm the only one bothered by writer-characters. How funny! I haven't seen that movie, Hells, but it sounds hilarious. *off to Netflix...*
I loved that article too, and the clear friendship you could see. I must be too far out of the loop to get the Xtina jokes, but it was still funny.
I'm with you on the rich tycoons/CEO's. Part of my problem is that I don't understand what they do all day. Sure, they're businessmen, or whatever, but what do they actually *do*? And why do they have so much spare time? It bothers me.
Now, stick him in a pair of wranglers and slap a toolbelt on him, and then we can talk :)
Ohh, that does sound funny. I'll have to find it. And yeah, the plot for Waterhole #9 isn't one you could pull off today. lol
When I think of CEOs, I think of Donald Trump, who isn't sexy. And I doubt he's useful, except for getting a restaurant reservation at the last minute--but I don't think that's a real skill. I want someone who if we're on an island and have to survive, he's USEFUL.
CEOs, sheiks, princes--they're schmooze and play golf. I just want to roll my eyes. I'm a snob.
Oddly though I love the British royals and have a little cougar crush on Harry. Still I wouldn't want to read a story about a prince wooing the chambermaid...because a prince would never actually marry a chambermaid.
What makes Waterhole #3 (sorry, not #9, I was thinking love potion??) funny is that Roger Miller (country singer) sings these songs throughout the movie to narrate it along and the lyrics are hilarious. It's campy, but completely off-color!
dude. the more you explain, the funnier these movies sound.
That is funny that you hate schmoozers, but like British royalty. I'm with you, though. I want a man who knows how to do things, and isn't afraid to work hard themselves. Not someone who has a staff to do shit for them while they golf and woo chambermaids :)
Checking in late today -- had a doctor's checkup this a.m.. I'm fine, but I'm not doing any more appts. first thing in the morning again. Traffic, couldn't finish my coffee -- it threw my whole day off! LOL
I don't think I have any aversion to writer characters. And I don't have any aversion to billionaire/CEO characters -- although in real life I would have a problem because I'm used to being lower on the employment food chain, and my experience is they never know what us worker bees are doing but it doesn't preclude them from making stupid-ass pronouncements from on high. LOL So yeah -- not real sexy in my estimation.
Since I'm used to doing everything myself, it would be nice to have a man take care of some things -- but not all the time where they try to take over. So it would be more like a vacation, or mancation. LOL
Okay, more coffee. Be back in a sec.
Nice post Hal! My personal hated cliche is the secret baby. Not a fan - in fact I'm not a fan at all of "family" stories. If there is a child involved it's not usually a story for me.
I do remember a Harlequin I read one time with a kid that was VERY well done, but can't remember the book or author. It was one of the only family stories I've read that I actually liked.
I’m used to being lower on the employment food chain, and my experience is they never know what us worker bees are doing but it doesn’t preclude them from making stupid-ass pronouncements from on high
LOL Donna! I agree entirely. I grew up poor, so I always proceed with the assumption that anyone that high on the food-chain is basically a narcissist. Which I'm sure is not a fair assumption, but it does play in when I read about rich tycoons.
A mancation. I like that idea! While I like having the hubs around to keep the house in working order, I wouldn't mind a vacation *from* him now and then. LOL.
Yes, yes there is. lol
That is funny that you hate schmoozers, but like British royalty.
As you pointed out, there is always an exception to the hated cliche. *LOL*
Hi Scapegoat! Ugh, secret baby. I hate that one too. And I'm with you on small children in books -- they just need so much time and attention it skews the focus of the book for me.
Although, I say all that, and in my last manuscript, there was a secret baby that made an appearance, and a six-year-old floating around. LOL. So maybe I shouldn't say I hate that plot too much :)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Hallelujah_Trail
I can't find one on Waterhole #3 (though admittedly I think the Trail one is funnier.)
I am not a fan of novels or books where the H/H are in the "writer" world. The only exception to this is "Stranger Than Fiction" where the author is the narrator of the main character's life. I found it amusing. Especially the ploy to find the right way to kill him off.
Stranger Than Fiction--God, I loved that movie. I loved how damned neurotic she was and always thinking about death and killing herself. *LOL*
Oh, I loved "Stranger than Fiction"! Another excellent example of when the cliche can be used perfectly.
I avoid books with children in them too. And dogs. *LOL* Granted, Linda Lael Miller is always scattering dogs and kids in her books and I read her books every time, but as a rule, I read books to relax. Children are not relaxing.
Plus I think dogs and kids are cheap manipulation tools. Inserted to make us feel empathetic with the hero/ine without any real effort. *LOL* After all, if you can't feel empathetic for someone who takes care of kids and dogs, clearly you're a hater. *LOL* Which I am.
Plus I think dogs and kids are cheap manipulation tools
I agree completely. Though I also agree that LLM is one of my few exceptions. She always has kids, or single parents, or a whole menagerie of formerly-abused animals looking pathetic and now being loved. Very cheap manipulation, but it works on me every time. LOL
Great post Hal!!
I have a hard time with a bunch of these. Secret baby, sheik (but not the other rich dudes), and love triangles (though I picked up Jennifer Haymore's debut 'cause I heard good things).
I don't mind the writer plot device most of the time. Except when it's exactly as you describe. The romance writer who's all pathetic with no life. I liked Penelope Featherington. She was a writer. And so was Colin in that one.
I also liked Christina Dodd's article. And I liked how she focused on freshening up the cliches, giving them our own spin, instead of trying to create something completely new and different.
I gotta run to the doctor, but I'll be back to catch up in a couple hours!
Marn, we have very similar reading tastes! I've only read one Sheik book (Dana Morton, after she was here one time), and I liked it. I haven't tried any others, but generally, the whole Sheik concept makes me uncomfortable. *shrug*
Penelope Fetherinton! Another good example of when it's done well. Maybe because it's a historical, she didn't feel so "writerly" to me. Either way, I adored Penelope and Colin :)
Well, at least now I know who will read my books and who will not.
So far, Chance might be my only reader.
I don't like the Sheiks because they are UBER ALPHAS and I hate uber alphas, regardless of their station in life. I don't mind CEOs/Rich heroes. Everyone started somewhere and a mechanic can be as much of a prick as a rich CEO.
I do not like the secret baby plot, mostly because I can never go along with the reason WHY the baby is a secret. The only time it worked for me was in the movie August Rush, because even the mother doesn't know the baby survived. She's told after being hit by a car that the baby died and the father never knew about it at all. (She was rushing off to tell him when she was hit by the car.) So in that case, I could go along with it.
The hero of my ER novella is a writer. There's no dogs but a cat and a kid in PFK. My next book is a love triangle. Basically, I'm a no for all of you.
Forgot to say I loved that article. Finally, someone preaching the truth that none of us are writing anything original and not worrying about being PC about it. LOL! Xtina is a trip.
And I killed the blog. All before lunch. Yay for me.
Bo'sun, as we said, we've all got exceptions for our dislikes. That's what the blog was about...sorta. How we hate these cliches, but sometimes they really work! *LOL* Just make sure they really work.
And I've said the "nothing original" thing before! No one listens to me!
You have a real complex. LOL! We all listen to you. We rant about how brilliant your blogs are.
The real problem is you're not listening to us!
And you have to admit, what were the chances one of us would have ALL the cliches people don't like? LOL! Of course, that one would be me. *dips Hershey bar into jar of Peter Pan*
LOL. Ter, we're going to love your books. Remember, we don't like it when these cliches are done *poorly*. that's the caveat. Yours are going to be brilliant, and then we'll all have to change the cliches we hate because we love yours so much.
Don't forget, I admitted to a secret baby plot, which almost everyone hates. LOL!
Yes, but I think you're lumping us all as a group when we're being negative on an individual level. *LOL*
Hal doesn't like books with heroine writers--but most of the rest of us did.
I don't like kids and dogs--but you do, Janga does, and clearly Jenny Crusie does since she includes them all over the place. And Hal and I agree the exception to the dog/kid rule is Linda Lael Miller.
Janga doesn't like love triangles--and Marn didn't care for them either, but I believe Marn likes Twilight and that's a love triangle. With a vampire "forbidden" cliche to really amp it up. I, however, love love triangles (so long as it's two men, I'm so sexist), perhaps because I'll never have that problem to have to choose between two awesome choices. *LOL*
I like writing about "forbidden" cliches, the occasional love triangle, and reunion stories. Some people don't like reunion stories--some people, with good reason, could never imagine reuniting with their ex. *LOL*
And as Xtina points out: cliches are not the problem. Cliches are things we like, things we enjoy and speak to us. Read the article!
Oh, that leads to the idea of the love triangle with two woman and one man a la Sound of Music. Notice in that case, the "other" woman is clearly made out to be a bitch.
I think you almost have to do that. If you look at the end of Four Weddings and a Funeral, many people hate that Hugh Grant's character picked the American woman, when the friend who loved him forever was more right for him. Not making that friend a bitch meant they didn't convince the viewer he picked the right woman.
I did read the article, I said so above.
I'm well aware there are always exceptions, but the odds weren't looking good there for a minute. LOL!
BTW - I bring up the "make her a bitch" thing because I'm determined not to make my "other" guy an asshole. He will clearly not be right for the heroine, but he's not going to be a jerk either.
Though I have no idea how to fix the "someone gets hurt" thing, especially since they are brothers and will need to co-exist in the future.
Easy to fix. Write the book to the 2nd brother next and have him fall in love with someone you couldn't imagine him being without. *LOL*
Well, I'll throw a cliche into the mix before I dash out the door. . . all those mashup books (i.e. Jane Austen and some paranormal creature). The first one or two might have been clever and fresh, but now it definitely feels like a cliche. Only it's one that should have a stake driven through its heart, its head cut off, and buried at the bottom of the sea (even the Kraken would spit it out).
(I hope I didn't sugarcoat that too much. LOL)
Clearly you need to read it again.
Yes, that's the problem with love triangles. You have to make it clear who is the better fit, and it usually done by making one of them a complete asshole. That's not fair. That's not the case. They're both great choices...but which one do you love more? You usually know...it's that universal truth of "you can't help who you love."
Donna - I'm with you! Everytime I hear about another one of those things, my teeth hurt.
Yes, I figure the brother will get his own book. But I'll have to do something to appease the readers at the end of the first or they won't be willing to read the next one. LOL!
He's a Typa A personality lawyer. I think he'll need to have a revelation about his life before he finds the woman for him. Which I guess having your fiance fall in love with your brother could be the perfect revelation instigator.
Brother definitely has to get his own book. Totally solves the problem.
I agree with Hellie -- no one story is going to appeal to everyone, and there's probably no story that everyone will hate. And in the hands of a good writer (like those of us on this ship!!!), any plot or cliche can be perfect.
I think you all have usurped my Pollyanna role today. LOL!
And we're back to "You can do anything if you do it well enough."
Hal - How did you work out the secret baby to make it work for you? With no spoilers, of course.
Burt Lancaster, in a bathtub, with a cigar in his mouth...lovely movie... And the barrels are full of whisky. I swear, I went to be last night the the marching song of the anti-booze ladies ringing in my ear!
I have to say, I'm not a fan of secret baby, though I use it at one point. But not to bring Mum and Dad together. Instead it works as a plot point for Dad to show how dangerous it is to be related to a pirate...
I can handle a well-written kid. And I love dogs and cats in books, period.
In my last book (a thriller/RS), the heroine had been told her husband was killed while she was still pregnant. He was told (by villain) that the baby died. So they all went on with their lives and then when the kid's 6 is where the book starts, and he finds out that the child is actually still alive.
So it's not like the heroine snuck away to have a baby, or just didn't tell him, she just thought she'd been widowed and lived accordingly. But they still all become a real family at the end *in unison now..."ahhhhhhhh"*
See, that works for me. It's when the heroine does the "I can't tell him/he doesn't love me/I don't want him to stay only because of the baby" stuff that makes me want to stab people.
How is that book faring, btw? Still seeking a home? Under the bed? (Hope not, that book sounds awesome.)
It had gone out on submission late last fall, and been passed on several times. Then when the agent hoopla happened, the new agent pulled it from submission, as we both agreed it needed more work, and had gone out too early. So now I'm (slowly) working on revising it, waiting on comments from the agent as well on what to change, and hopefully we can submit it again to better results.
I'm also about half way through the (loose) sequel, so it may be that I can finish this one up, and then have better luck selling them as a set.
I was disappointed when so many editors passed on it, but....*shrug*. It's not under the bed yet. I think it still has potential in there somewhere.
The Jane Austen w/ vampires cliche needs to die--but again, as proof everything works somewhere, I read the FUNNIEST book: Shakespeare Undead. Shakespeare is a vampire; the dark lady is a zombie killer; and Elizabethan England is overrun by zombies.
I don't even LIKE zombies; don't watch the movies...but this book was hysterical.
Bo'sun, I so agree! Don't give me the 'oh, woe, I must hide my expanding self as he doesn't really love me' crap.
Or, 'he has so many great things to do, a baby would only stop him from serving the world' bullshit.
Not saying those things don't happen, but I don't want to read about it and generally just flat out don't believe in the idea. Especially in historicals when the challenge of being an unwed mother would be all but insurmountable.
Unless the author creates an alternate world, of course!
Oh, cliches. I think I love most of them - even the secret baby. My first thought was I haven't used them, but I was wrong and just blanked out on what's considered a cliche. I'm lazy and needed to google cliche for a bit of a list.
I've used a few actually...the amnesia plot and the virginal heroine in one, and the other some evil relatives. I guess I hadn't thought of evil relatives as a cliche, but they do occur often. One site said the hero carrying the heroine was cliche. Done that. Often. Who wouldn't love that? :) Yep, love cliches.
Hellie, Syrie James's next book is a vampire book. It broke my heart to read that, but it sounds so good except for the vampire part and she's such an extraordinary writer that I may suspend my vampire exclusion policy long enough to read Nocturne.
Jo Beverley gave the secret baby plot the best twist I've ever seen in A Lady's Secret where the secret baby is a nun but not really. :) Almost every hackneyed plot I can think of, I can also think of a writer who used it and made me love it.
Ter, I'll read your book. As Hellie said, I like kids and dogs. I have both in my book. Will you read mine?
Off Topic: 99 days until the release of HP and The Deathly Hallows, Part 1!
EW says, "Part 1, by the way, will end at about Chapter 24 of the book, with Voldemort gaining possession of the Elder wand, one of the three Deathly Hallows that allow the bearer to conquer death."
I was going to send Hellie an email, but then I thought some of the rest of you might be interested too.
Janga, I already read Syrie James' Dracula book. *LOL* It was really good, followed the original Dracula story (as I know it, because I obviously didn't read the book-book, I watched the 1992 movie).
*screams about HP* Les than a 100 days???? *does a little dance*
The Elder Wand, huh? That seems...well, distorted because there are only 36 chapters in the book. (Only, I say, it's a 700 page book!) So it's like 2/3 of the book will be in this two hours; and then the other 2/3 of the book will be in the other two hours. *LOL*
But I wouldn't want that job--figuring out where to split it, so wherever...as long as I get to see both parts!
God, I can't add. 2/3 in the first 2 hours; 1/3 in the 2nd 2 hours.
Hey Melissa! Yeah, I think we all use them, and I never realize until later. About the third time somebody reminded me that I have a secret baby, I had to stop bad-mouthing that cliche :) But I never thought, while writing, "Ohh, let's stick in a secret baby!" It just came, you know? So it never felt cliche to me since it was organic to the characters.
Carrying the heroine is cliched? I guess it is a bit over-the-top-romantic (I can say that I've never been swept off my feet and carried out of the room by a man....lol...even the thought makes me laugh!). Okay, now I'm curious....has *anyone* been swept off their feet and carried from the room? Threshold on the wedding night thing? Maybe it's just me and I've had lazy boyfriends :)
Janga - I dropped my anti-vampire policy for Barbara Monjem earlier this year and didn't regret it. Give it a shot!
Are you asking me or Hellie to read your book? Because I'm pretty sure you already know my answer. LOL!
Hellie - I think any HP fan would be happy with 4/3 of the book. LOL! Bonus footage!
I thought that was an interesting job of addition for a moment, then I thought...well, maybe it's a back up to what is skipped, so each movie could be 2/3 of the book. Just a different 2/3!
Up the stairs while my legs were wrapped around his waist.
that's hot. I have done that in a book. Huh. There's another cliche. Who knew?
I have the hero carrying the heroine. Who wouldn't want that? *sigh* I wasn't carried over the threshold on the wedding night thing, but I have been carried. Up the stairs while my legs were wrapped around his waist. It helps if the guy's really strong. LOL! Especially since I'm not exactly *light*.
If that's a cliche, then just about everything has to be.
Okay, now I’m curious….has *anyone* been swept off their feet and carried from the room? Threshold on the wedding night thing? Maybe it’s just me and I’ve had lazy boyfriends
Yes. But not in threshold fashion, more like picked up by the back of my thighs, jostled upwards and carried out of the room as quickly as possible. (Probably because once you get momentum going...) I was still wildly impressed, of course. Of course, Deerhunter does wrestle dead deer corpses at deer season and seems fine, and I probably don't weigh much more than a dead deer. *LOL*
Yeah, like what Bo'sun did. I've done that. More than once. I think Deerhunter likes to reassure he can keep doing it. *LOL*
more like picked up by the back of my thighs, jostled upwards and carried out of the room as quickly as possible.
LOL Hellie.
Of course that move is hot. It's Vin Diesel's signature move. *LOL* It's the REASON why we watch Vin Diesel move. "Oh, OH, OOOH! He picked her up!" --swoons
I think I was born outweighing my DH. So now being carried about anywhere... Sigh.
“Oh, OH, OOOH! He picked her up!” –swoons
Oh right! That's why I watch those. Thanks for the reminder :) Yeah, the original Fast and the Furious...*swoon*
I haven't been picked up and carried -- any guy that could do that with me, well, he'd have to be a giant and he'd be too scary. LOL (Yeah, I'm not petite. LOL)
Oh, and I don't watch Vin Diesel movies. I don't see his appeal. (Sorry.)
Donna - No wonder you're looking for a nice beefy SEAL... ;-)
I had a discussion with a petite friend once about fantasies and finally got through to her that not everyone has experienced the 'cliche' things. Like sex on a motorcycle, or on a beach, or being held against a wall... Because not all of us have men who can manage our...uh...curves. Yeah, curves.
*sexy little laugh* Yeah, the original F&F was great for that. *sighs*
Donna, I prefer more twiggy guys--Vin is not on my usual list, but the "pick up" thing and his voice, I'm willing to make an exception.
Plus he always drives the coolest cars in his movies.
Like sex on a motorcycle, or on a beach, or being held against a wall…
If it helps, I'm petite, and none of those things have ever happened to me either
The original XXX. THAT movie is freaking awesome. And that song they play when he walks into the bedroom to find that half naked chick on the big four-poster bed? That is the awesomist sex song ever.
If it helps, I’m petite, and none of those things have ever happened to me either
Well, I get the motorcycle--not everyone has that; and the beach, not everyone wants to deal with the sand...but the wall thing should be open to most. *LOL* Esp if you're petite (see the assumptions we curvy girls have!).
I've had the wall thing.
I'm sending Deerhunter a thank you card.
Hellie, I'm definitely a voice kind of gal, so I suppose if I closed my eyes. . .
Nope. He's got this whole Neaderthal thing going on that I can't seem to overcome.
Although, if this current celibacy streak continues, I may have to change my mind. LOL
Here's the link to the song. I had to look it up once I thought about it. LOL!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i3xesKwWsXo
LOL, Chance -- that's exactly it! A nice big beefy SEAL who can carry me around. LOL
Dang, Terri, you're gonna make me go look at that movie now. *grumble, mumble*
Maybe I'll watch some Vin Diesel tonight. It's been a while since I saw XXX. "The things I'm going to do for my country." *LOL*
As Hellie will tell you, I like my men without necks, so Vin does it for me. It helps that he has that sexy grin.
You know you wanna, Donna...
Sorry, Hal, not casting against the petite. But it's more likely you'll have experienced those things if you're petite...or a hell of a lot more confident than I am, even if you're more curvy, as I'm so politely putting it!
Nice song, Terri. And what is it about neckless men that you like? And, part two of the question, are there plenty to choose from? Just wondering. (I suspect now I'm going to see lots of neckless men, now that I'm aware of that quality. LOL)
I'm not sure, Donna. It could be a chemical imbalance in my brain. :) And I don't like the severe cases, really, but I'm settled now with the fact I have a reaction to men of quantity and not always quality.
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