Thursday, June 10, 2010
Why Do We Believe Them?
OK, crew…pet peeve Friday here. Firstly, why do we believe the tiniest, smallest, bare bit of negative feedback as gospel? WHY? WHY? WHY?
We receive heaps of praise from those who love us, know us, care about our career and we smile, say thinks…and then obsess on that tiny bit of nothing from no one we know. Hell, we obsess on the bit of negative nothing from people we don’t know!
I’ve seen this over and over again. Hell, I’ve done it also, but I am working quite diligently on retraining myself.
I’ve heard the argument that you’ll only hear positive stuff from your loved ones so you can’t trust them to be honest. I don’t buy it. And if that is how your loved ones work, well…get new loved ones. I expect people to be honest with me, period. None of this protect me crap. Don’t mean I want to be crucified by friends and family, but honestly! They know me best and know how to be honest with me.
Given, my f&f aren’t experts, but for a general opinion of storyline, plot, continuity…all my family reads. A lot. They know what works and what don’t. So, I do trust them.
Now, why are strangers considered experts? Even actual experts? Why do we trust them, implicitly? Let them set the stage and have the ultimate say over what we do and how well we do it? I do not get this. Even experts are wrong sometimes or have bad days and how many times was JK Rowling turned down before an editor said yes!?
I have a friend. A dear friend, who took her book to a scifi convention and entered it in the chance to be reviewed panel. Every single person on that panel loved her book. Praised her book, one editor said I want to see this when it’s polished… And then the last man on the panel tore her to shreds. Eviscerated the book, chapter by chapter. Her characters, her plot, her everything.
Who did she listen to?
The last man. And she put that book away, froze and didn’t write again for more than a decade. She later discovered this man was well known for doing this. A well known author who tore apart any promising author who came his way. (Now, I want to know, if this was well known what this asshole was doing being invited back again and again to destroy budding writers…but that is another story. Likely one I’ll never hear.)
Another example, more recent.
Last Saturday, at my local RWA meeting. One of the ladies was bummed. She got a rejection letter from Harlequin and it totally challenged her faith in herself as a writer. Now, one of other members had read the letter and insisted B. share details.
Crew, she got a personal rejection letter. Which began with a paragraph of all the things good and right about her book. Her plot, her dialogue, her characters.
Like…wow.
Then there was a detailed paragraph of why this book wouldn’t fit into the Harlequin model. And a list of changes that would be necessary to see it fit. The editor wasn’t really pushing B. to make these changes, but more like offering real justification for why she had to reject the book.
Was B. thinking of submitting it to other publishers, I asked.
Not really, she sighed.
I bit my tongue wanting to know why the hell not. I don’t know B. well, and I trust C. to push her toward trying another publisher. She did say she just wasn’t sure who else would want a contemporary with regency connections… Like…Avon!?
Anyway.
Now, I ask you crew…in these days of modern publishing. Of agents rejecting authors via Facebook…of being told no reply means you’re book was rejected…of the form rejection and a list of why there is no personal contact… Why was she totally dejected? Why wasn’t she thrilled that an editor took the time to write a personal letter? With praise for so many aspects of her book?
Hell, proof the book was read! In detail!
I’d have been thrilled!
Now, back to the positive vs. the negative… What is it about human nature that sees us take the negative to heart and dismiss the positive? From strangers, from family and friends… Are we so pathetic and self-flagellating that we insist on the right to suffer and be victims? Is it just we Americans? Is it just the people I know?
It is such a bloody waste!
I am pledged to pay more attention to how I react to words and from who. I know my family and friends love me and I trust them. If you can’t trust the people who know you…well…I’m sorry. You may not get the sharp criticism you need, but there are other avenues for that. But for basic honest opinion? Why not trust the people who have the good judgment to count us as friends?
What are we saying about ourselves that we don’t trust the people who we care for? What does this say about how we view ourselves?
Getting tangled here, I’ll try to step it back…
What are your experiences with believing the good verses the bad? Whether it comes from family, friends, strangers, experts…? Is it better to hear negative or positive when it comes to a learning experience? (Bad may steer you right, or it may run you up on the rocks. Good can do the same… IMHO.) How do you decide who to listen to and why?
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64 comments:
I figured I better step in right away and say something about experts. I do value their opinion, especially with regards to professional aspects of a book. It's opinion where I find myself mulish.
And I've been the victim of contrary opinion. We all have. I'm not trying to say contrary opinion doesn't have validity. I'm questioning the idea that it weighs so much more than any and every complimentary opinion we hear, no matter who it is from.
Now, I'm ready to be scolded and told I'm naive when it comes to my friends and family. Sigh. Go ahead, I'm ready...
I don't think it's naive to listen to family and friends. I think they're valuable in the support system for my writing.
Let's see, where to begin. I'll probably get shot down for this but honestly, I think the majority of the feedback I get (not ALL, I've had some completely useless feedback, stuff where it just seemed like they were reading some other book) is valid. And I've had good and bad, don't get me wrong. But in most instances, the critiquer is trying to tell me SOMETHING. How they say it isn't always beneficial or "nice," but usually there's at least a kernel of truth in even the harshest criticism.
Most of the time, when something someone says hits me funny or stings, I refuse to allow myself to read it again right away. I let myself wallow in the initial feeling of outrage or anger or hurt or whatever until the real bite lets up. After that, when I've given myself the distance to acknowledge that maybe there's something to what they're saying, I go back. After all, now I know what it "says"--no more surprises--and I can try to learn from it.
I usually don't let myself pick through wording or overanalyze. I just try to focus on the overall point. That way I don't let myself qualify why they're "wrong" and I'm right. Because really, what's right and wrong when it comes to this stuff? It lets me be a little more impartial. This usually works for me.
I think this may be a universal phenomena. Scientists and other academics writing papers for peer review, actors subjected to views of theater critics, anyone writing a proposal for project funding ....
I think its wise to treat comments from friends with caution. They are well meant of course, but often its the things that are not said that are most significant.
As to the impact of criticism, I think this is largely a matter of confidence. With a panel of reviewers you get a wide spectrum of opinion so there is almost bound to be someone who doesn't like the work. You have to understand the probabilities. If the severe critic is in the extreme tail of the opinion distribution, he can probably be safely ignored.
For budding unpublished writers though,as Chance observes, one caustic review can have a devastating impact when the writer is fragile and lacks confidence in her own ability.
While not wanting to filter out the extremes, they often have valid poins as Marnee comments, I do think that new authors should be shielded to some extent. With a panel of reviewers, its the chairman's job to scan the responses and perhaps request some moderation of the more extreme opinion.The author should also be allowed to respond to adverse comment.
With peer reviewed papers, there are normally at least three reviewers, and the editor adds his comments to those of the reviewers. If the majority approve, then the paper is normally accepted with a proviso that the author consider making changes to take account of comments.
With fiction, I guess the editor's comments will be more focused on saleability than other aspects!
Interesting thought Chance. *smile*
Chance, this is a wonderful post. It's something we all struggle with, and I'm pretty certain we'll struggle with it no matter what stage of the process we're in.
I think it's a protective mechanism, to keep from HOPING. Because if we're hopeful, then it hurts more when the good result doesn't occur.
It's taken me a lot of years to learn to just enjoy the good moment as it occurs. In the past if I got a partial request, I couldn't enjoy it, because I knew they were just going to reject it ultimately. A friend asked, "Even if that's true, why can't you feel happy about THIS thing now, that's exciting?"
I know I've told you about the Golden Heart experience years ago when I was a finalist, and I got 4 nines (highest score) and a 5. I nearly made myelf sick thinking, "OMG, that could have kept me from finaling". LOL Even though it DIDN'T, I kept doing the ole What If Waltz.
I've also come to realize it's easier for people to say harsh things than nice things. So I try not to discount the nice things the way I used to. :) They've put in the effort, so I should too.
I sorta agree with Donna--although I don't think it keeps you from hoping. I don't think one can keep from hoping--that's like air, you need it to live. No hope, you jump off a bridge--happens all the time.
But I do think negative thinking--or believing the negative--give you the illusion that you're in control of how much hope you have for a situation. If you have a little hope for getting published, but you're rejected, it's not as debilitating as if you had BIG HOPE and got rejected. It'd be like the difference between a balloon leaking air because it wasn't tied properly and it flopped to the ground versus a full balloon that is pricked by a pin. You prick the balloon with the pin and you'll be getting ready to jump off a bridge.
I think the negative thinking is our way of "controlling" a situation we have no control over. We cannot control what people think of our books...or will say about our books...and so we're going to try to control how we react to their reactions. We don't want to give them the satisfaction that them calling our baby ugly hurt us.
And as for the lady who was upset about the rejection letter that was personalized--this is ONE instance that you know about. This could have been her 100th letter...or maybe only her 10th. She's maybe been writing for 10 years, has 10 manuscripts--and they've all been rejected. If it is yet another manuscript, and it's yet again another rejection--maybe her head is just not in a good place to deal with rejection. Any kind of rejection. Also if she just got the rejection letter, like Marn said, she hasn't given herself enough distance to look at it objectively.
Comparing her reaction to how you'd be though isn't fair. You're two different people. And you weren't the one rejected--so you really couldn't say.
Marnee - You have a real good foundation in regards to your writing. And you make me consider that my outrage isn't so much for the practical stuff that helps us grow our skills...as we covered last week, peer groups, critique groups, they all have their place in helping us hone our skill.
It's a good idea to put things aside and pay attention to what really tweeks us, good and bad, so we can later go back and consider it more subjectively.
Perhaps my outrage stems from who we let so far in that we lose ourselves at the negatives. And why we truly tend to ignore the positives we get from friends and family.
Why do we dismiss it as lies?
The rejection we get from editors/agents/judges can often be tainted by their personal experiences as much, if not more, than the experiences our family have with us.
Your hero's name is Fred. They just broke up with Fred. In fact, Fred broke their heart, cheated on them, with their best friend... We end up the victim of that very, very, very bad day. But we don't consider any of those possibilities, we read the snarky rejection and believe we can't write.
Why is it easier to believe that than to believe anything else?
Ah, Q! If only there were a board that would take the time to consider and make logical sense out of rejections! Perhaps in the academic world, there is. But I somehow doubt it. Sigh.
I disagree that we have to treat the words of our friends and family with caution. I think we need to acknowledge that they aren't professional editors/ agents/judges and so don't have the vocabulary to offer us substantial critiques.
But I'd like to think that if I walked out of my house with something hideous on, color clash that is so phenomenal, I'm going to blind the blind...my BFF will tell me.
Possibly with a smart assed comment, possibly with some kindness, but they wouldn't protect me and allow me to look ridiculous.
And I'd like to think that an editor/agent/judge is looking at the marketability of a project. And I do believe that is their job...I also believe they are human and have bad days...
AKA, JK Rowling. What did I read? 50 rejections? Something like that.
Donna - Isn't it sad that it's easier to say horrid things than it is to say good things? What is it about our society that promotes that mindset?
I understand the lack of civility our modern culture has. Where television shows are made up of real people tearing into each other and teamwork is seem as a sucker's game...but honestly!
I can see what you mean...we hope and so we set ourselves up to be deflated.
But what of the reverse? We have no hope so when something positive is said, we assume they are lying to us, to not hurt our feelings, etc.
It just seems like a real no-win thing!
I know that anymore, I take the feel-great moments and just rest with them. Knowing that they may be nothing more than moments that don't amount to anything lasting. But! For that moment! Ah, it was glorious!
Chance, I think it's also easier to believe negatives as we get older because we've experienced the loss of certain illusions.
For instance -- SPOILER ALERT -- there's no Santa Claus, Easter Bunny, or Tooth Fairy. LOL We learn that people aren't always truthful, that they have their own motives that don't focus on our happiness or success.
So we end up cushioning our tenderest parts (not THERE, filthy pirates! LOL) to make sure we can make it through another day without feeling too much pain. Our writing is probably the most vulnerable spot, so one method of protecting that is to discount the positive, and buy into the negative.
The trick is to be able to move past that -- a character growth for writers kind of thing. Some days are better than others!
There IS a Santa Claus. And you can't convince me otherwise.
The tooth fairy and Easter bunny are debatable.
Hel - I can see the negative thinking being our way of asserting control. I know I used to say, expect the negative and your seldom disappointed but sometimes delightfully surprised.
And I still believe that in many ways. But the trickiest part of living that way is how do you haul yourself out of the the expect the negative to simply enjoy and believe the positive when it comes your way?
The lady in my RWA group has finished two MS. Her heart is set on Harlequin, so they are all she has submitted to. Her focus is so narrow in regards to publication, she limits her possibilities. I'm hoping, with some time, she can look at that letter and see the good stuff and consider looking for another publisher.
How often does anyone get such a personalized letter from an editor anymore?
I hope I didn't sound like I was judging her, and I apologize if it came across that way. I was so surprised at how low she was about it all. And the hippie dippie in me wanted to hug her and whirl her around to see the good stuff it contained.
Donna - Yeah, I do get the protective aspect of it all. Hell, I used to live behind one of those walls. I had over twenty books written and never even considered trying to get them published. I mean, who was I?
And I considered myself the most fragile thing on the planet, knowing I would just DIE if I were rejected.
Then I almost died.
Puts a whole new perspective on the hiding factor. The not living factor. The not taking chances or believing in anything factor.
Now, I have to tell Sin to quit knocking teeth out when she needs spare change...thanks for the heads up!
I know you didn't. But this lady probably hasn't almost died before--and therefore doesn't have your skill set at keeping things in perspective and focusing on the now.
I don't know why she'd only want to be published with Harlequin though. Not knocking Harlequin's quality vs other publishers--but their shelf life is so short, that I think it would be hard to make money (which I know is not why anyone writes). They have like a MONTH shelf life. Personally I'd prefer someone else--but I'm sure she has her reasons.
I sure hope people don't have to almost die to open eyes to the positive side of things... Sigh. It's not really a route I'd recommend!
I know, I'm not personally interested in being a Harlequin author, but she's older than I am and undoubtedly has an attachment to the 'glamour' of being in their stable.
My other friend, who was eviscerated at a scifi con...she looks back on it and is totally pissed at her reaction. But understands it. Perhaps there is a perspective that grows with age. I know when the eviscerator died she did a happy dance around the room...
I agree that perspective comes with age. I remember throwing around that "I would just DIE if. . ." line a lot. And then after experiencing the death of someone I loved, and how painful it was to get through that, well, it definitely changed my perspective. It's also when I decided I was going to get serious about writing. I faltered after that, but it was a reminder that if I could endure that, I could endure anything.
So...which sort of news contributes to your growth? Good news? Which, if you can convince yourself to believe it, means you do have something to say, you are saying it nice, and others just might pay money to read it... So, it powers to forward momentum...
Or bad new? Which gives one food for thought, which when handled with grace, illuminates dark areas you need to shine up and points you in the direction toward getting there?
I do think everyone has a different fuel for their engines...
Donna - I heard something on the radio that I nearly discounted a few weeks ago...that those past he age of 50 tended to be happier than those younger. I thought, "NO!"
But it went on to support the study and I realize a lot of it pointed to a change in perspective. A lightening of the drama, I suppose. When the biggest drama in ones life is the growing closer to the end of life...it does put things into perspective as to what is important and what isn't.
Too bad we don't get that burst of do or die earlier, when we have more energy!
I don't know how you could go to a scifi con and not be eviscerated. RWA and RT conferences always seem to me to be the book equivalent of a Mary Kay convention--and I mean that in a good way. They're positive, uplifting--on the whole. (I know there are smaller cliques within that are contrary to this, but I think on the whole, it's really women lifting up other women.) But a scifi conference seems to be the polar opposite of this. I don't know why, per se, except that men in groups don't seem to be positive reinforcers. Their idea of bonding seems to be trash talking you until you're inspired to come back and be so successful, you can tell them to suck it.
Men are weird.
Scifi is such a boy conference. I know there are plenty of women who love scifi conventions, but it's still very much a boy's club to me, so you have to play by the boy rules--which is trash the fuck out of each other. If you're not willing to swallow a little bloody from the rugby match, then you don't need to be out on the field.
Well, Hellie - The last few scifi cons I was at...the women outnumber the men. And it's growing more and more toward that tendancy.
I know the con where my friend took part in the writers workshop...man...ten years ago? And there were men and women on the panel. And as I said, all but one were supportive. They focused on the positive... It was the eviscerator that she believed.
Just her nature at that time to embrace his slashing and discard the good stuff.
Lots of great points brought up so far. I'll throw in my hat for a lot of this being personality. Some people take rejection well, some don't. Some have reached a place of confidence, some are still getting there.
To quote Garth, it's standing outside the fire. Some choose to dance into the flames, believing the risk is worth the reward. Others stay well outside the ring out of fear. They're so afraid of getting hurt, they never join the dance. One brush of heat and they run away.
I have to respectfully disagree with Donna. I think it's harder to say something negative. I've been lurking with writers for enough years now to know most would rather blow sunshine up their fellow writers ass than tell them their baby needs reconstructive surgery.
Now, NASCAR...that's where the trash talking between guys reaches a crescendo of stupidity. And I'm sure that is true of all sporting events. NASCAR is the only one I have experience with.
I bet deerhunter does it with his other deerhunter pals... You're right, men are strange!
Ah! The dark flipside of the girl's group?
So far, with the little critiques we've done in my RWA group and the help I've gotten from a few friends and family, I don't think anyone has been blowing sunshine on me...I hope!
But yeah, sometimes, the path toward keeping the peace means not saying what needs to be said.
Man, just give me the truth... Without snark but with explanation.
I changed from a negative attitude to a postive attitude about nine years ago, and I wish I had the potion to say how I did it. Part of it was dropping dead weight (the divorce) and part of it was finding something positive that boosted my confidence through the roof (the boyfriend). But what really did it was seeing the results. Seeing things shift for the better simply from how I was living and thinking every day.
Another problem with this stuff is that it's all opinion. I know we say the experts can see what works and what doesn't, but the bottom line is, it's ALL OPINION. There are books in print right now that I think are HORRIBLE. I'm flabbergasted that an editor bought this book. And I'd bet my pinky toe that most experts would agree with me.
Yet, someone is reading those books and loving them. It's ALL OPINION.
Now, I have to tell Sin to quit knocking teeth out when she needs spare change…
I only knock them out because the Undead Monkey likes them. When he gets to bugging me about candy, I feed him another tooth. High in calcium and protein.
I have a negative attitude about my writing as it is. One more person telling me it's not publishable isn't going to challenge my writing interest. I've already told myself I'll never publish.
But why would you bank on only one publisher?
So true, Bo'sun! There is true drek out there right now and someone...an EXPERT...thought it was worthy of publication. Which simply screams at the flip thought...what isn't getting picked up?
I read a blog by Nathan Bransford yesterday about the e-book revolution and how it will shift the burden of who decides what makes it to the reader. Interesting perspective! I liked it so much, I posted a link to on my FB page! Something I seldom do...
I don't think allowing the negative comment to overshadow the positive is unique to writers. I hated reading student's evaluations as a teacher because if I had one bad evaluation in a group of twenty-five, it was the one I remembered. Twenty years ago, one student called me mean-spirited, and that still bothers me. Most of my colleagues responded in similar ways.
I'm with Terri on friends' critiquing. I think it's difficult for many of us to point out flaws. When I serve as a beta reader, I find myself apologizing for anything negative I say. :(
Thank goodness, some of mt friends--not naming names--are strong enough to say, "You need to . . ."
Ah, Sinster...we don't need that monkey growing any bigger or stronger...no more teeth!
Well, if yer starting with the idea that I am unpublishable (something I find debateable) then every good word should be simply a good word... Right?
Or are you convinced that you're being lied to?
Janga - I imagine a teacher's perspective on creative work is valuable...and so easy to see it carry weight. I know I always valued the things my teachers said and wrote on my papers.
It's interesting to shift the focus to how one feels when one is honest and gets slapped for it...
Sigh. Perhaps it depends not only on the toughness of the skin the writer has, but also the toughness of the skin the reader has.
I need to give this some thought!
I have to respectfully disagree with Donna. I think it’s harder to say something negative. I’ve been lurking with writers for enough years now to know most would rather blow sunshine up their fellow writers ass than tell them their baby needs reconstructive surgery.
I'm going to respectfully agree with Bo'sun. LOL I think it is hard to tell a fellow writer something negative, but it's because we know how writers respond for the most part. I try to couch any criticism with "you might want to try" or "you might want to think about". Hopefully it shows I'm interested in a positive outcome, and it won't come across as negative or hurtful.
Donna - I know when my local RWA group decided to start working on monthly critiques, we discussed how to correctly get your point across. And the entire discussion began with the instruction to always begin with a positive.
I suppose, when it comes down to to, it connects back to last Friday's discussion on finding and weighing a critique group.
Though that isn't where I was hoping we'd go today. But more the concept of why do we ignore good news in favor of bad news...
OK, off to walk the dog. Who sees everyday as a GREAT DAY!
I cannot imagine Janga being mean-spirited. Those sorts of things stick with me too, Janga.
Donna - That seems like the best way to go, to make suggestions. But it all depends on the relationship. How well do you know each other, how long have you worked together, how does the other person react to things. HOW something is said is almost more important than anything. I'm always happy to hear suggestions, even if I don't always take them. LOL!
why do we ignore good news in favor of bad news
So this is the real question. The answers above all seem like good ones. It's human nature, it's a way to control our hopes, or at least pretend we're controlling something. Maybe it's easier to believe. Doubt is normal, belief harder to come by. That would be why half the planet works on faith their entire lives.
I have a friend who tells me I'm gorgeous. I'm sure that's what she sees, but that's not what I am. No idea why I can't just jump on that bandwagon with her, but it's not going to happen. LOL!
Maybe it's because we can see the gap between where we are and where we WANT to be. I will have to ponder this too!
Or are you convinced that you’re being lied to?
Lying is a basic part of human nature. Lying to yourself is easy. I tend to think the opposite of what I want to happen so that I can prove myself wrong- hence by lying to myself I make shit happen. But being lied to about my writing? In regards to quality of writing, I don't think it's necessarily a lie. When I ask someone about my writing or am given feedback on my writing, I generally feel like people just want to say something nice. Or in the case of the letter, maybe the publisher thought that the writer needed a reality check. We all need those from time to time. But you can't rely on everyone loving what you write. You have to write what you love and love what manage to pour out on the page no matter what anyone says about it. If you can't believe in yourself, no one will.
What Q said! I think its wise to treat comments from friends with caution. They are well meant of course, but often its the things that are not said that are most significant…
As to the impact of criticism, I think this is largely .. matter of confidence …” I also believe that it is a matter of competence .
Competence A: on the part of those who judge you. In other words … do you respect their life choices? If you don’t respect a person. Don’t have a genuine regard for their work, or respect for the kind of life they lead … then really? Their opinion … should have very little value to you. My Opinion.
Competence B: The artist/writer has to hold themselves accountable. Work at the craftsmanship of their craft. Set goals. Reassess their work and set goals again. In my experience confidence is directly linked to competence.
I generally feel like people just want to say something nice.
For the Record: I NEVER just say something nice.
Ever.
Of course you do. You email me about bedazzling beer bottles. That's nice.
And for the record, I tend to say exactly what I think when I think it. You have to be forewarned before you meet me that any little thought that pops up will be voiced, regardless if it's painful or not. That is, if I actually speak.
That is, if I actually speak.
Oooohhh trust me my dear SIN. You'll speak. Even if its just to tell me to blank off!
Sin's not kidding. How do you think the "Amanda Wilson" thing got started?
There IS a Santa Claus. And you can’t convince me otherwise.
The tooth fairy and Easter bunny are debatable.
It was like seeing the Flying Dutchman sail into your driveway. You’ve heard rumors about it. But to actually see it?
The Party Bus?! Who knew that it really existed? OMG I Laughed so hard I thought that I was gonna puke. The look on my DD’s face when I told her that I was gonna hitch a ride on the thing. I got a ten minute lecture about women welding bdazzelere-what-evers and bejeweled beer bottles. LMAO. Her final assessment was: if the Party Bus was REAL then so was Santa Claus, the Tooth Fairy and the Easter Bunny!
OMG she was soooo serious.
You have to be forewarned before you meet me that any little thought that pops up will be voiced, regardless if it’s painful or not
Goshhhh ... I Never noticed this about SIN.
Not.
I do think everyone has a different fuel for their engines…
My fuel of choice? Neither Good news. Nor Bad. I prefer … Challenging News. Challenge me? And … well lets just say God help you.
So...you think it's human nature to lie, eh, Sin? I think it's human nature to want to be liked...also a basic survival technique...if they like you maybe they will let you sit next to the fire and not throw you out into the cold where the sabertooth are...
But! It's an interesting dilema in modern society. The ideas of faith, of truth and balance it with being liked.
Sin...you don't really see it as lying when it refers to your writing... This just really makes me smile. Then...what is it?
Definition police! Julie, you crack me up.
So, if every friend and family member and critique partner and critique groups says you are the absolute bees knees with this book... And one editor says, "ugly" is every good word considered a lie.
Why do we consider these people THE experts? Again, how many times was JK Rowling rejected? By EXPERTS!
Who is to say the amateurs, the readers, aren't the true experts?
I suppose it is true, who do you consider competent to offer critique?
What do you treasure?
Donna said Chance, I think it’s also easier to believe negatives as we get older because we’ve experienced the loss of certain illusions.
Donna , we could have a very long discussion about this. But I’d have to tell you my life story. Wouldn’t want to bore you. Plus SIN would probably blackmaile me, and the captain would throw me over board. My illusions crumbled long ago. Interestingly enough when my illusions disappeared … so did my dilutions. I am actually a more positive person because of my negative life experiences. Perhaps … because I know that the sun still rises every morn’ … even if I cannot see it. Or feel it. Or enjoy it. I know. It is there. It rises In spite of me, not because of me. And that knowledge sets me free.
Julie and Donna - That was the thing about this study... It said the older a person is, the more positive there are regarding their outlook on how life is working out.
I think a lot of it is living in the now. Not so caught up with "when we arrive" and not so lost in "what we didn't do, lost, etc". When you're on the downhill side of life, every day is precious and the focus seems to shift to that.
And I don't mean that in a gloomy way!
While I agree that it is also basic human nature to want to be liked and a part of a social function in society (humans are social animals), wanting to fit in contributes to white lying when asked your opinion of another person/object/thought. Most people, given the opportunity, if asked for their opinion have the social grace to white lie (when the opinion is not of the consensus) to fit in. Conform. And we all know you don't like to conform, Chanceroo.
Neither do I.
White lying and lying are two different art forms. White lying is basic, easy, almost the truth. And everyone white lies when it comes down to the basis of human nature.
Oooohhh trust me my dear SIN. You’ll speak. Even if its just to tell me to blank off!
Jules, dear, I have no doubt in the instance we meet that we'll talk. My opinions and truth will fly in that conversation than people will be able to deal with and we'll just laugh about it.
I tend to think the opposite of what I want to happen so that I can prove myself wrong- hence by lying to myself I make shit happen
SIN your fuel isn't lies. Its Challenge!
Well, I do like to fit in, to a certain extent. I have a MIL who is able to bend the truth to suit herself to such an extent...I tend to be crazy about the subject. Lying that you are doing something because it's easier than letting the person down with the truth, that you don't have time, that you want to but it isn't going to happen...drive me crazy.
She's made it impossible to speak truthfully to also. The only way to get her off your back when she isn't getting her way is to make up a lie that serves as the perfect excuse.
She's a lie enabler. And I hate it.
So, I tend to be careful about the whole lying thing with most every other aspect of my life.
White lies? Well, I'd rather find a way to tell the truth and still be welcome next to the fire. Sometimes it works, sometimes it don't.
Yes Chance, that's supposed to be DeluSions ... legerdemain salutary quodlibet buffo delusions!
Sorry, that last line was me...darned italic imp!
Here's my convoluted theory: You get more positive when you get older because you're in pure panic denial of "this can't be all there is!" Then you get busy because there isn't much time left. :) But the one negative still scream the loudest over a crowd of positives because you're in that loop of panic and it just seems like good time management; that's the thing that needs to be fixed. So you brush the positives aside politely because they can wait. Nice, but they don't need any action from me. Time's a wast'in. The negative that knocks you down means you sure as hell better get up because the longer you wait the harder it's going to be - - to get up that is. (Aches and pains and all. LOL)
Oh, Melissa! If only that worked for me! I do love the theory! If the negatives around my house (the mess, the dust, the clutter) would really motivate me to get going on fixing them. I must be the most contrary person out there!
All it makes me want to do is move outside where the flowers are blooming and I ignore the weeds and just enjoy the breeze and scent of pink jasmine in the air...
But I love the idea! Like Donna's HOA, this one should go in the books. Melissa's Theory of the Loud Negative... I'm sure the other pirates can come up with a better sounding title.
But I totally love it!
Thanks, Chance! I'm in an Algebra class now and my life is filled with positives and negatives. I'm such a sponge. LOL The negative always seems to override which doesn't seem at all fair!
AHA! We can blame it all on mathematics! Sounds like the most logical thing to me!
Math killed the blog.
It will do that. I know, scares me, too...
I had to go out and commune with the real world for a bit. LOL Now I've got a headache. Let me see what everyone had to say, and I'll be back. :)
The real world will do that to you!
I forgot there are more people out and about on Fridays, so I had to cut my planned excursion in half. LOL
And I like your sister's observation that people think "only negativity is real honesty". That's an interesting point.
Isn't it? I feel like she summed up my entire blog in five words.
Chance and crew~
Very thought provoking blog. I prefer the truth, howvever I try not to bludgeon the other person with it.
Di
Sin: While I agree that it is also basic human nature to want to be liked and a part of a social function in society (humans are social animals), wanting to fit in contributes to white lying when asked your opinion of another person/object/thought. Most people, given the opportunity, if asked for their opinion have the social grace to white lie (when the opinion is not of the consensus) to fit in. Conform.
Gawd, Sinful philosophy is so delicious. Could be straight out of Karl Popper! :wink:
Melissa: Here’s my convoluted theory: You get more positive when you get older because you’re in pure panic denial of “this can’t be all there is!” Then you get busy because there isn’t much time left. :) But the one negative still scream the loudest over a crowd of positives because you’re in that loop of panic and it just seems like good time management; that’s the thing that needs to be fixed. So you brush the positives aside politely because they can wait. Nice, but they don’t need any action from me. Time’s a wast’in. The negative that knocks you down means you sure as hell better get up because the longer you wait the harder it’s going to be
I can never resist a new theory! Most of us get wiser with age with a more relaxed 'been there done that' attitude. With a burning ambition to satisfy, and brain cells firing less frequently, then this sort of makes sense. Rather like a plant bursting into one final fling of bloom and seed production just before reaching the end.
I don't believe you're at that point Melissa. Sorry, the theory don't wash. You're far too young! :lol:
Jules: In my experience confidence is directly linked to competence.
Absolutely agree. :D
Chance: AHA! We can blame it all on mathematics! Sounds like the most logical thing to me!
Feminine logic I think. :lol:
Di R: Very thought provoking blog. I prefer the truth, howvever I try not to bludgeon the other person with it.
The voice of reason at last! :D
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